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Old 01-26-2013, 11:58 PM   #56
WoundedBear
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: miami,ok born in mo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toolbox View Post
Elo, you seem to have totally misunderstood my statements and arguments. No where did I or anyone here state that the government would become tyrannical and a heavily armed militia would break down the doors of every gun owner in the country. You're right the second amendment won't be removed but it is appearing that with new bans based on irrational fear are going to diminish it. How would you like to be told that your freedom of speech doesn't protect you from speaking bad about the president? That would be a diminishing right.

Relaying the stats and figures for the gun deaths was only to debunk the idea that most of the deaths were criminally related. Most were suicide. That proves that we have a severe problem with the care of people with mental health issues in this country. Something everyone can agree on, including the NRA. As for it sounding as if I, or anyone quoting the criminally related deaths, as something to just let go by the wayside because criminals are scum is incorrect as well. The argument still holds true that if someone wants to kill someone they will find a way to do it. I remember years ago someone was murdered a few blocks away with a sledge hammer. My brother's friend was nearly killed when he was beaten with an axe handle. People are stabbed, run over, poisoned, beaten and strangled. The simple irrefutable truth is that at the end of the day we are merely animals, though highly intelligent, and as such we have violent tendencies. Have you ever gotten angry at someone or something and started to lash out, even if it was just throwing something across the room? Some of us are better equipped mentally to control how violent we get when something gets our adrenaline and the stress hormone cortisol pumping. It's simple biology. Guns are just a tool. Again if not guns someone will use something else.

I will give you the fact the NRA has some extreme views and can at times foam at the mouth. I'm not a member of the NRA or plan to be for that matter, I just see no need. As for the giving a grade to politicians on how well their stances align with the views of the NRA well that is really meaningless because every organization does it to some extent. Activist groups for pro choice and pro life, the environment and a host of other causes do it.

Again the other irrefutable fact is that there are way too many guns in the country, more than there are people in fact. Some banning things or limiting things without removing whats already on the streets isn't going to have much effect and that was proven with the ban that was in place from 1994 to 2004. Also rifles and shotguns only make up a small portion of gun deaths, most are handguns - a fact that even Obama stated during his town hall presidential debate vs Mitt Romney.


By the numbers for year 2011. 2012 numbers don't come out for several months.
Handguns: 6,220
Rifles: 323
Shotguns: 356
Other*: 97
Not Stated: 1,587

*Other means uncommon weapons such as smooth bore pistols and combo rifle shot guns. Also could mean "garage guns", but they may be listed as Not Stated".
Source: http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr...e-data-table-8

With that in mind, tell me how banning semi-auto rifles will drop the gun death numbers down when most are handgun related suicides?

We do need to take some actions and as I have said most of it is going to be caring for mentally ill and removing laws and roadblocks that prevent the enforcement of the current and new laws. Some of the roadblocks were created by the NRA. We also need to work on improving the education system and the economy we need to take real world proactive approaches to dropping the crime rate in all areas and more specifically urban areas with extreme levels of poverty.

I hope everyone understands that I'm not trying to sound like a foaming out the mouth guns on every corner nut job. I'm just stating the real facts about firearms. Yes they do kill people and animals, I'm not denying that. All I'm trying to say that this media blitz and fear mongering over semi-automatic rifles is total BS because they only account for a small number of deaths each year and more so a lot are just ordinary hunting rifles.

If we ban guns we might as well ban alcohol. Alcohol related deaths, excluding accidents and homicides in 2010 was 41,682. Alcohol related traffic deaths was 10,228. Of the 1,210 children killed in accidents 211 were due to a drunk driver. 1.4 million arrests for DUI. http://www.cdc.gov/motorvehiclesafet...factsheet.html
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/alcohol.htm

You see what I'm getting. Alcohol has a limited legitimate purpose, outside of that it's a drug, it impairs people's judgement and a fraction of it's users while intoxicated on it end up killing innocent people. The same concept can be applied to guns. They have a limited legitimate use (hunting, defense, & sport) I'm not for banning alcohol (prohibition) that didn't work in the 20s and it wouldn't work today. As well I enjoy a drink here and there. We did get NASCAR from it though.



***Sorry if it seems as if I'm jumping around between years when sourcing stats but the years given are the most recent I can find doing a quick search as opposed to digging through the FBI's and CDC's websites.***
I hope it don't come down to that toolbox cause if the come thrue my door like wise and attempt to harm me or anyone in my place I will fight in self defiance and when I fight I fight to kill and to do vital harm and if u.s. gov is behind it I will take on the entire u.s. on single handed I fear no or any force of any kind and if I die doing so than so be it
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