View Single Post
Old 02-17-2017, 09:13 PM   #15
OLChemist
Pow Wow Committee
 
OLChemist's Avatar
 
Items ElephantPresent
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
OLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond repute
OLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond reputeOLChemist has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 3,152
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
I am going to sound harsh. Some of what I's going to say is harsh. But, if I didn't want to try to communicate, I won't be writing long posts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Broken Arrow View Post
.. Some things are very special relativ and some things are very relative special (Bad translaton of a German joke on Einsteins Relativitätstheorie)
I recognized it. You may have figured out that I'm a physical chemist. I tell bad science jokes, too.


Heisenberg and Schrödinger are driving in a car and they get pulled over. The police officer asks: "Do you know how fast you were going?"

Heisenberg says, "Well, not really, but I can tell you exactly where I was."

The officer thinks that this peculiar response is grounds for a search. He finds a dead cat in the trunk and he says: "Do you know that there's a dead cat in your trunk?"

Schrödinger replies, "Well, I do now!"


Good to see you have a sense of humor. It will get you far in Indian Country. We tease hard.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Broken Arrow View Post
Maybe more qualified native Americans should write books to reach those who can learn only by reading books and use them as a tool for education. Most books on native Americans seems to be written by white people and lack vital information.
There are many books written by Native peoples.

Here we have a collision of worldviews. Our histories and cultures are by and large not in books, I'll exclude the Cherokee for the moment, since they developed and utilized their own system of writing within their own language and culture, and for their own uses. Our cultures by and large have very different modes of transmission of knowledge. We have different ideas about intellectual property. This ideas are rooted in our understandings of how the universe works.

Many teachings within our cultures are restricted to those within our culture and maybe only those who are qualified to get them. And there is no hard, bright line separating sacred and secular in many of our cultures. So, things which might seem to have no religious/spiritual component in the western world, do in ours. These things we guard jealously.

Think about your culture. Is there a book telling you how to make authentic German Scherenschnitte or Bergmannsfigur? I could make a miner's angel. I'm a good enough craftsman. I could make an exact replica of one my mother's Volga German immigrant neighbors gave her for Christmas when she was a child. But it would lack the creative spark of the real thing. No book could teach to me create this item in its cultural context.

This isn't about race. It's about being part of a community and tradition. I know many a non-Indian family member who makes regalia for their Native relative. What they make, I consider authentic. For they are creating it within the cultural context and kinship connections that animate Native life.

I know hobs, who do meticulous research. The read books, travel to distant museums, study pictures. They produce exquisitely crafted pieces. They get antique beads. They brain tan. They find exactly the right species of wood to smoke the hides. They find exact color matches for ancient earth pigments. But their pieces are dead.

I have two parfleche bags hanging in the dining room. One is painstakingly pounded elk rawhide. With rabbit skin glue fixed, earth paint designs. The techniques used to produce it, were absolutely faithful to 18th century Cheyenne technology. It is a magnificent piece. The other is a tiny bag. Made with somewhat shiny, Tandy Leather cow rawhide. It's painted with modern acrylics. The color blocks are edged with black lines drawn by a Sharpie marker. It was made by a Cheyenne teenager, who was trying to earn money for a car.

White people love the large elk hide bag. It fits their idea of "Indian" art. Indian people are drawn to the small bag and ignore the other. They sense the young girl, a link in a chain of artists who used the materials at hand. The spirit of her bag is true to the form and purpose of these bags.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Broken Arrow View Post
What I am missing in this book as well as in others is an explanation to the meaning ore in your words the use and spirit of a composition. A book written by a native person might overcome those missing dimension ore faults in the existing books and again can teach other people. If such a book exists, that should be easy to find. And that would clarify what not to use.

Why do CrazyCrow, Wandering Bull and the other trading posts sells such books instead of getting them enhanced for the above vital information?
Maybe our art and our religion are something we're not eager to share. I've heard it said: "The white man is like a raccoon. What he can't eat or tear up, he defecates on." After everything that has happened to our peoples, give us a reason we should be willing to teach the colonizer's children how to make our art forms?

Now, that said many of us are more accommodating. I'm a softie. I've taught non-Indians who've showed up on my porch and had the right attitude. Some even survived :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Broken Arrow View Post
Wardancer demands what my interest is. Would he answer me, if I would demand an answer from him why he uses something from our culture? Why adopted so many whites in the beginning (1700) to the Indian way of life?
Do you have any idea how tired we get of hearing how if we don't want to share the precious remains of our cultures that we should give up jeans, horses, pickups and antibiotics?

More collision of worldviews.

One: We weren't given a choice about participating in the dominant culture. (In English "dominant culture" is a sociological term that refers the mainstream Euro-American institutions, manners and mores.) We live utterly surrounded. In many cases, our traditional economies are destroyed. Should we let our children starve to remian "pure"?

Two: Most of the items that I suspect you would point Wardancer's using are mass produced commodities. He is not asking to be given the means of making these items -- i.e. he's buying and using an iPhone not making one.

Having a long term relationship with my patent attorney, I can tell you that the power of the legal system of every western country acts to restrict and punish unauthorized use of intellectual property. You have patent, copyright, and trade secret laws. We don't. And our intellectual property is plundered with little regard. Our legal and moral frameworks do not have standing in your systems.

Why did we adopt whites? Because humans form bonds. Kinship is what makes us civilized. People make friends, people form alliances, people fall into love and lust. The difference in those relationships is we choose. We are the gatekeepers of our families and communities, not you.

If you understand that, then there is a chance for us to get along.
OLChemist is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook