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Old 02-12-2018, 08:39 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by OLChemist View Post
@ChildrenFromTheSun Can you provide the links for the sources of those visualizations of genetic divergence? I'd like to look a the source papers.

I never thought you were being racist. I was rather clumsily reminding you that the dominant culture has not infrequently welded science as a club. I fear science's decoding and understanding of the expression of the human genome is outracing the development of societal ethical and moral constraints. Indians are too often the canaries in the coal mine, to borrow a metaphor from Felix Cohan. We especially need to be careful with our use of this information.

Or maybe I was just overthinking it, LOL.
Two of them can be found on this thread: Amerindians cannot be Mongoloid; they and Australoids are equidistant genetically to East Asians

The Haplogroup Q-M242:

As for the gif, it's supposed to be found here, but a link to it is no where:


I did find another data map of Y-haplogroup frequencies that caught my attention:

I definitely agree to pay close attention to such genetic studies. It doesn't hurt to identify any genetic differences either, especially if they don't bear any influences upon anyone in any way.

Originally Posted by wardancer View Post
It wouldn't matter if you did , those bounderies have already been established !
Sure, just remember they were established by the colonizer's government.

But we're not ! So we all have varying degrees of pigment , but the truth is and this is my own personal opinion , our culture and belief systems are not even the same.Not even close ! We aren't sun worshippers , other that "I like a day at the beach" and I'm certainly not sacrificing anybody hoping to gain favor with the Gods !
Like you said, that's only your opinion. You can totally believe in whatever you desire. I certainly hold my own on the concept of race. So you don't believe in race?

I do and when I say race, I do not mean we're so culturally similar. I'm well aware of cultural distinctions. Nevertheless, there are definitely cultural and historical parallels between all Native American populations.

I apply biological, loose cultural and historical similarities, social acceptance/awareness, and geography to how I define race. After all, most of this criteria is involved in defining race throughout history, even to this day. It is not merely similarities in pigmentation on why I claim Native Americans are all the same race. It involves other physiological traits as well, such as eye structure (e.g. epicanthic folds, socket position), cheekbones, hair type, teeth, nose structure, etc... And once again, physiology/phenotype is NOT the only criteria I base race upon.

I emphasize on my claim we're all the same race to promote an effective degree of unity. Is there anything you have against unity?

Usually ? I don't really believe that. I don't think our friend Broken Arrow would fit in the same box as someone from Ireland or Wales. Or even France or Spain ?
Considering the racial definition of White/Caucasian is defined as anyone from indigenous origins in Europe, then of course. Why are you mentioning Broken Arrow though? Is he/she mixed race?

We are a conquered people. We exist because our ancestors made treaties the the conquerors. They did what they thought best to save not only themselves , but their children. It was "let's make a deal or else we'll be eliminated" ! Now , we as tribal people have to live with that. Our forefathers wanted us to survive , to continue our culture , our beliefs, and it is our duty to do so. There will always be that line we can't cross if we want to continue to exist !
Keep in mind the biggest reason, by far, for the defeat of virtually all Native American nations was not through the colonizer's military prowess. It was pathogens that did the VAST majority of the dirty work for the colonizers. Otherwise, I certainly would argue that they would've stood no chance against Native American nations, especially the deadliest, war-mongering ones.

But yes, it became a life or death situation and I'm aware there was no greater options at the time.

Congress could decide tomorrow to do away with all the treaties , outlaw casinos ,do away with "Tribes" and there would be nothing we could do.Do you really think that if all the "brown people" stood together we could take back the continent ? If you do then you are crazy as a loon ! Good luck with your agenda , I'll watch from a distance.
Did you ever hear from anything regarding my proposed movement? I only ask since you're making near-assumptions akin to someone else has done when they heard of it.

I'll just say I do not intend for us to reclaim the entire Americas. I do intend for us to establish a great sense of unity between all Native American nations, a beneficial degree of "pan-Amerindianism."

I also do not intend to rush ASAP into reclaiming any land, especially not in the current status of Native American nations. I intend for this to occur in a peaceful manner as well, not with bloodshed.

Last edited by ChildrenFromTheSun; 02-12-2018 at 09:02 PM..
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