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Old 11-19-2003, 04:25 PM   #61
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Dang Bingo_Orphan, it's all good. I never said you had a problem with anything. In fact, you brought up some good points. I agree with a lot you said, especially about the centerpiece and attaching the bustle to the base.

Originally posted by Bingo_Orphan

I do have a center piece rosette that I use but it's purely for aesthetics, it doesn't hold the loops down to the back board. I guess your best bet is to figure a way to get your loops more precise so that you don't HAVE to tie them down any number of spike loops. All that is really needed is maybe a single tie at the bottom of your backboard just to give some stability to your feathers. But even then, after a while you run the risk of that tie "cutting" the string thats in your loop and breaking it so that all your spikes come out. Which would really suck during a contest!

I always thought a center rosette was a nice touch. Just something more to an outfit anyway. I didn't know that there was a distinction to not having a centerpiece as being "Northern"


I couldn't agree more. Well said!

My only question remains..... Is it hard to get the spikes uniform due to the natural curve of the feather? Some curve more or less than others. If so, how do you get around that problem?
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Old 11-19-2003, 07:11 PM   #62
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Hey, no problems here. It's good to have an opinion, I certainly do! Everything can't be black and white, we need that grayness every now and then.

I'm with bwhite in that I want to see some pictures of these bustles. I'm sure they're great, but I can't recall ever being impressed by unstraightened feathers. Proove me wrong.:violin:

Last edited by BeadMan; 11-19-2003 at 07:14 PM..
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Old 11-26-2003, 04:28 PM   #63
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mailorder and bustle supplies

Nocbay also sells bustle supplies and kits with instructions (plus all the supplies you need) The whole kit runs about $120 US and looksk pretty good when you get it done.

www.nocbay.com

I like my fancy bustles with the natural curve in it. I started out a tradish dancer and we just don't iron our eagle feathers at home... I just can't get used to the look of a straightened feather (For myself). However, the looks just fine on other peoples'.

Thanks all. Peace.:)

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Old 12-08-2003, 06:10 PM   #64
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bustles

eagle bustles are the way to go
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Old 12-08-2003, 08:21 PM   #65
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Old Skoo Fancy,

I'm wit you on dat Eagle Bustle thang....Eagle Bustles be da BomB!!!
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Old 12-08-2003, 08:40 PM   #66
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black and white eagle bustles definitely, have had quite a few comments at powwows about being ol skool
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Old 12-08-2003, 08:48 PM   #67
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Robby,

I know you man.....you alright!

Keep jammin' bro! Keep your stylez!!
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Old 12-14-2003, 08:35 PM   #68
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so can anyone explain the primary, secondary laces to me.....

Is this one long lace that is wrapped around each dowel and seperated by pony beads??

I have an idea in my head that is what the guys around here do is they drill through the dowel at the seperating lace....

can anyone clear this up?
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Old 12-23-2003, 09:40 AM   #69
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There are two laces that hold the bustles together. The Primary lace is strung through the loops at the base of the feathers. There is no space between the feathers here. This lace ties the feathers to the bustle base at two points.... basically like the top of a horseshoe.

The secondary lace is the lace that spreads the feathers. I've seen it done two ways. One, the lace is threaded through holes drilled in the dowel rods. The other, the lace is threaded through holes drilled or punched through the quill of the feather. Believe it or not, I think that going through the feather is stronger than going through the dowel rod. Most of the time, the feathers are spread evenly by spacing them with beads on the secondary lace.

The secondary lace ties directly to the uprights on the bustle base.

To make the bustles have a nice cone shape, string the feathers together and lay flat on a table or the floor. When all the feathers have been strung together, and without the bustle being mounted on the base, you want the top left spike to be between 9:00 and 10:00 on a clock face. You want the top right spike to be between 3:00 and 2:00.

Then, when you mount the bustles to the base and tie the secondary lace to the uprights, it will pull the bustle into a nice cone shape.

If you can imagine the clock face again.... If the top spikes go past the 10:00 and 2:00 positions on the clock, then they probably lay too flat when mounted. (Then they rub together, collapse and all kinds of nasty stuff)

Just reduce the number of beads between the feathers or actually reduce the total number of feathers used to get the desired shape. It's all trial and error.

Hope that helps.
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Old 01-13-2004, 10:45 AM   #70
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Echo that - the quill is almost always stronger than the rod. I've had many rods break off at the hole, so I switched to harnessing through the quills. Even if I accidently split the quill, it still superglues back together pretty strong (just like when you accidently stick your fingers together;))

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Old 03-14-2004, 03:41 AM   #71
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is there any way to get a shape other than the standard "U" shape on a fancy bustle? I was thinking a pair of bustles shaped like batwings and done up in black purple and silver would be cool. Also, does anybody actually do quill wrapping on their spikes?
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Old 03-26-2004, 09:08 PM   #72
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Talking

Quote:
Originally Posted by crabbyolebear
is there any way to get a shape other than the standard "U" shape on a fancy bustle? I was thinking a pair of bustles shaped like batwings and done up in black purple and silver would be cool. Also, does anybody actually do quill wrapping on their spikes?
DOH!! *laughing really hard*bat wings! must be the bear thing with caves right crabby?


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Old 03-28-2004, 03:09 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dancin by the bay
DOH!! *laughing really hard*bat wings! must be the bear thing with caves right crabby?


Well, that, and so that nobody else will look like me.
I've wracked my brains over this, and the only way i can figure to get the batwing shape I'm wanting is prolly to make the dowel extenders varying lenths. I'm going to try to make a mini mock-up of that this week to see how it works. if it's a go, I'll see about putting the pictures up for you guys to see.
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Old 04-16-2004, 04:41 AM   #74
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I personally dig the style of well-made curved bustles. Spike Draper has a set that he uses with his pewter (?) outfit that I think is really well done.

Orphan is right - the straight spikes are a little harder to dance in for big guys (I'm 6'4", so I feel the pain) because of the lack of airflow between feathers. The curved feathers, especially on the neck bustle when they're pretty high up, have a smaller profile against the air so they're easier to move with. There is a compromise, though, for guys that prefer the straight spikes (such as myself) and want better movement. In the new set I'm making, I've rotated the spikes a little (about 20 degrees or so) along the axis of the quill. That way the bustles still have a nice full look, but air can flow in between the feathers a lot better and let the dancer move more easily.

I shamelessly stole the method from Marty Pinnecoose because that bammer still owes me a fish sandwich (long story) :Chatter
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Old 09-06-2004, 08:27 PM   #75
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Unhappy help me pleaseeeee

okay my husband and I are putting together a set of bustles for my 14 yr. old nephew and we got everything from crazy crow (the all hackle super deluxe bustle kit ) and we did everything the way the instructions said to do and for some crazy reason the bottom bustle isn't shaping like a cone, our feathers are all lying flat and when we attached it to my nephews backside the feathers go all the way in ( kinda looks like a war bonnet)...lol anyways I am in dying need of help with some sort of info and anyones help will be better than nothing...this is our veryyyyyyyy first time doing this and we need all the help we can get!!! another thing our bustle looks empty can it be because there isn't enough feathers they dont look full we followed the instructions and went by how many hackles to put on and where but you can see in between the spikes...and does anyone think I should get some wooden dowels because I didn't use any. Thank you
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Old 09-07-2004, 09:26 AM   #76
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frybreadboogie72

I would think that, for a 14 year old, you woud want to extend the feathers a little with wooden dowels. These also make the feathers very uniform in length.

As for the spacing, you probably want at least 36 spikes per bustle for a full bustle. I think mine have 48 spikes per bustle and are really full.

To get the nice cone shape so that the bustle doesn't lay flat... string the feathers (secondary lace) putting two crow beads between each feather. Work start at the bottom, in the middle of the bustle, and work your way up either side from there. String the bustle until the top spikes are at approximately 9:00 and 3:00 as if looking at a clock. Don't go too much beyond 9:00 and 3:00. DEFINITELY not beyond 10:00 and 2:00.

If the bustle is at the 9:00 and 3:00 position when laying flat on a table or floor, then when mounted to the base, the secondary lace will pull it into a nice, neat cone.

Don't be dead set on using all the feathers. You may need to add some or remove some to get the 9:00 and 3:00 position right. If you have to leave some off, save them as extras for when and if he breaks a spike.

Good Luck
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Old 09-08-2004, 09:42 AM   #77
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bwhite

I would like to say Thank you so much for the info. I will give it a try and see how it comes out. I have another question the instructions tell us to use a coat hanger to run the secondary shoelace through and tie them together to hold what can I use besides the coat hanger can I use a long dowel rod and if so how would I attatch it to the board because the hanger doesn't seem sturdy enough?
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Old 09-08-2004, 01:12 PM   #78
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You're right, coathanger wire really isn't strong enough. I use thin steel rod that I get from Home Depot. Either that, or, I have found some HEAVY duty coathangers from Target. They work pretty well when straightened. But, regular coathanger wire won't work. I wouldn't think dowels would work either since they can't be bent.

I bend the wire into a "W" shape and lace it onto the back of the base with a thin shoelace. I bend the wire into the "W" shape and trace it onto the back of the base with a pencil. Drill several smalll holes along the tracing and then lace the wire on in that fashion. Gently bend the uprights into the desired position and, using a pair of vice-grips and needle nose pliers, bend the top of the uprights into a little ring. This is where you'll tie the secondary lace.

If the bustle lays at the 9:00 and 3:00 position when unmounted, then mount the bustle to the base. Tie the secondary lace to the uprights, and THEN, finish bending the uprights to the desired position so that the ends of the quills (primary lace) lies flat against the base.

Remember, each set of bases is made to fit a particular set of bustles.

I'll try to post some pictures of my bases.
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Old 09-11-2004, 01:40 PM   #79
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I bought all the dowels needed and now I guess I need to trim the spikes to slide them in just like you did on one of your pictures that you posted and I will get the wire at home depot and get that taken care of so I can start working on the bustle...a picture would help us out to give us a idea...Thank you for all your help.
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Old 09-16-2004, 10:21 AM   #80
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my grandpa showed me how to cut dogwood "y"'s and split them. we would attach them to the backboards with buckskin strings.
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