Register Groups Members List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Like Tree2Likes

Forum Home - Go Back > Pow Wow Arena > Men's Dance Styles > Northern Traditional Dancing Let's talk Roaches Let's talk Roaches

Reply LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 01-22-2010, 04:04 PM   #81
Experienced
 
Historian's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Historian has a reputation beyond repute
Historian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Earth
Posts: 1,489
Credits: 546.14
Savings: 0.00
Other versions of hair roach position.

Osage man - 1875


Comanche man – 1891


Bushy Tail - Otoe - 1894


Jim Two Hatchet - Kiowa - 1898
__________________

"Be good, be kind, help each other."
"Respect the ground, respect the drum, respect each other."

--Abe Conklin, Ponca/Osage (1926-1995)
Historian is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 01-22-2010, 05:29 PM   #82
its to cold up here
 
legalstraight's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
legalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond repute
legalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond reputelegalstraight has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 341
Credits: 599.56
Savings: 0.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhoMe View Post
i am interested in finding out how the classic Sioux roach came to be. For some reason, I think their migration had a lot to do with it.

I have some friends on the east coast claiming that the roach originated there. This may have some historical merit. I witnessed two Souian speakers from two completely different areas speak and understand one another. Both were elders. One was from the east coast (Catawba) and one was from Nebraska (Santee Dakota).

Interesting huh?
Any Catawbas out there correct me on this, but as I understand Catawaba had all but died out by 1930 or so but there were enough folks that spoke little bits in the 50's that folks were able to go out to other Siouan tribes and sort of fill in the pieces (verb conjugation, certain missing nouns).

I know my friends that speak Ho-Chunk can pretty much understand Ponca, Otoe and Kaw. Osage is a little tricky at times, and Lakota/Dakota deviates quite a bit but you can parse it together
legalstraight is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 01-23-2010, 11:38 AM   #83
Experienced
 
Historian's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Historian has a reputation beyond repute
Historian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond reputeHistorian has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Earth
Posts: 1,489
Credits: 546.14
Savings: 0.00
The Siouan Language family is quite extensive, and covers a wide area with many sub-groups and dialects as seen in the diagram below. Speaking the same or similar root language did not guarantee that there would not be curtural or political differences.

The Siouan family consists of 19 languages with various sub-languages:

I. Missouri River Siouan (a.k.a. Crow-Hidatsa)
1. Crow (a.k.a. Apsaalooke)
2. Hidatsa (a.k.a. Gros Ventre, Minitari, Minnetaree)

II. Mandan Siouan
3. Mandan
a. Nuptare
b. Neutare

III. Mississippi Valley Siouan (a.k.a. Central Siouan)

A. Dakotan (a.k.a. Sioux-Assiniboine-Stoney)
4. Sioux
a. Santee-Sisseton (a.k.a. Santee, Eastern Sioux, Dakota)
i. Santee
ii. Sisseton
b. Yankton-Yanktonai (a.k.a. Yankton, Central Sioux, Dakota)
i. Yankton
ii. Yanktonai
c. Teton (a.k.a. Lakhota, Lakota, Western Sioux)
i. Northern Teton
ii. Southern Teton
5. Assiniboine (a.k.a. Assiniboin, a.k.a. Nakota)
6. Stoney (a.k.a. Alberta Assiniboine)

B. Chiwere-Winnebago (a.k.a. Chiwere)
7. Chiwere (a.k.a. Ioway-Otoe-Missouria, Ioway-Otoe)
a. Iowa (a.k.a. Ioway)
b. Otoe
c. Missouria
8. Winnebago (a.k.a. Hochunk)

C. Dhegiha (a.k.a. Dhegihan)
9. Omaha-Ponca
a. Omaha
b. Ponca
10. Kansa-Osage
a. Kansa (a.k.a. Kanza, Kaw) (X)
b. Osage
11. Quapaw (a.k.a. Kwapa, Kwapaw, Arkansas)

IV. Ohio Valley Siouan (a.k.a. Southeastern Siouan)

A. Virginia Siouan
12. Tutelo
13. Saponi (a.k.a. Saponey) (X)
14. Moniton (a.k.a. Monacan) (X)
15. Occaneechi

B. Mississippi Siouan (a.k.a. Ofo-Biloxi) (X)
16. Biloxi (X)
17. Ofo (a.k.a. Ofogoula) (X)

C. North Carolina Siouan
18. Woccon (X)

D. South Carolina Siouan
19. Catawba

(X) = Extinct language
__________________

"Be good, be kind, help each other."
"Respect the ground, respect the drum, respect each other."

--Abe Conklin, Ponca/Osage (1926-1995)

Last edited by Historian; 01-23-2010 at 11:56 AM..
Historian is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 12-06-2017, 07:02 PM   #84
Shawnee Hawk Clan
 
Mamaquit_Sipi's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Mamaquit_Sipi is an unknown quantity at this point
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Pelawasipi
Posts: 5
Credits: 162.31
Savings: 0.00
Button Roaches.

As for the roach, my people and family have said that for a long time the only traditional headwear for our tribe was button roaches, and otter/ beaver turbans. After a while, the otter and beaver were becoming endangered. So, in the 17 and 1800's we used cloth as it was easier to use and obtain. Instead of hunting, skinning, and tanning for an otter/beaver turban. Our roaches were worn at the top of the head, sometimes with clipped feathers tied together in with the roach, and leather or cloth tails with a few feathers, accompanied by a quilled wheel with a few feathers. Variation of turkey, eagle, hawk, owl, vulture, woodpecker, macaw, mourning dove, blue jay, goose, kestrel, and crow. Few other I may have missed. We wouldn't wear feathers up a whole lot, you would see more of an eagle tail feather tied flat on the roach. It would be mainly quilled pieces until the introduction of beads. We used turkey beard, and deer hair. Porky hair if we had it depending on where you lived in our homelands. Although through the course of Tecumseh's leadership he and Tenskwatawa spoke to our people about using less cloth and back to our traditions. However that leaves me at a blank spot on if we wore them alot from the late 1700's to early 1800's as you see more cloth head wraps instead in that time.

At least that's what you can see from paintings, as we didn't generally like to be painted or written about so there are few Shawnee portraits compared to other tribes. At least this is what I have researched and how it has been taught to me. I am by no means an expert, none of us truly are. Always more room to learn and grow.

Now on to finishing my regalia. Hope all is well with everyone. Have a good holiday season. I am looking forward to speaking with you all on these forums. Have a good one!
alumphfres likes this.
__________________
Shawnee dancer, and drummer. Getting on the pow wow trail.

Hope all is well with everyone.

"A single twig breaks, but the bundle of twigs is stong."
- Tekamthi/Tecumseh

Remember Wounded Knee, but also Remember Standing Rock! The attacks on our peoples continue to this very day. On which side will you be when we make history? Choose the right side.

Last edited by Mamaquit_Sipi; 12-06-2017 at 08:46 PM..
Mamaquit_Sipi is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 12-06-2017, 07:10 PM   #85
Shawnee Hawk Clan
 
Mamaquit_Sipi's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Mamaquit_Sipi is an unknown quantity at this point
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Pelawasipi
Posts: 5
Credits: 162.31
Savings: 0.00
I know of the Tunica Biloxi Nation, and then there are Saponi-Tutelo, and Monacan in Virginia still. Many tribes in Virginia going for federal. Some are Siouan. Virginia seemed like the place to be I guess, as there are Iroquoian, Siouan, and Algonquian language peoples there.
Mamaquit_Sipi is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 12-11-2017, 11:52 AM   #86
PauWau Coordinator
 
WhoMe's Avatar
 
Items Devil
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
WhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond repute
WhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond reputeWhoMe has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Land of 370 Broken Treaties
Posts: 7,133
Credits: 10,968.98
Savings: 0.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhoMe View Post

Roaches with crowns - worn by the modern traditional dancers - will also have an evolution.

Just wait and see.
Just reading an old thread from 2007. It seems this prediction has come to pass....
wardancer likes this.
__________________
Powwows will continue to evolve in many directions. It is inevitable.
WhoMe is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 12-12-2017, 08:10 AM   #87
The voices tell me...
 
Joe's Dad's Avatar
 
Items CatCatCatCat
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Joe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond repute
Joe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond reputeJoe's Dad has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: I'm right here!
Posts: 15,645
Credits: 102,507.46
Savings: 1.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhoMe View Post
Just reading an old thread from 2007. It seems this prediction has come to pass....
Did you envision roaches made with optical fiber in the circle? lol
__________________


Why must I feel like that..why must I chase the cat?


"When I was young man I did some dumb things and the elders would talk to me. Sometimes I listened. Time went by and as I looked around...I was the elder".

Mr. Rossie Freeman
Joe's Dad is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 12-12-2017, 10:11 AM   #88
Senior Dancer
 
Broken Arrow's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Broken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond reputeBroken Arrow has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Germany
Posts: 573
Credits: 5,214.89
Savings: 0.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe's Dad View Post
Did you envision roaches made with optical fiber in the circle? lol

Miracles should happen, I have heard; though that seems always very far back in the past, the miracle or wonder.
__________________
Those who do know do not write and those who write may not know. Frank W. Louis, No such Agency

True peace between nations will only happen when there is true peace within people’s souls.
Black Elk

“Tell me, and I will listen.
Show me, and I will understand.
Involve me, and I will learn.”
Lakota Proverb

God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
Courage to change the things I can,
And wisdom to know the difference.
Living one day at a time,
Enjoying one moment at a time,
Accepting hardship as a pathway to peace.
(Reinhold Niebuhr, but the origin is debated)
Broken Arrow is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Sponsored Links
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Roaches gdFancy182 Fancy Feather Dancing 2 07-30-2002 10:01 PM
Hey talk to me! anita Jingle Dancing 3 02-11-2002 12:02 PM

    

Join the online community forum celebrating Native American Culture, Pow Wows, tribes, music, art, and history.

Join PowWows.com Today!

Your Guide to Native American Pow Wows Since 1996

Register For Free

Enjoy the benefits of being a member of PowWows.com!

Join our Native American online community focused on Pow Wow singing, dancing, crafts, Native American music, Native American videos, and more.

Add your Pow Wow to our Calendar

Share your photos and videos

Play games, enter contests, and much more!






New Threads

Pow Wow Calendar Search

 
Month: Year:

Location:
Facebook Profile Images

Videos

Featured Articles

Dance Styles

Crafts

Gallery