Register Groups Members List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Forum Home - Go Back > General > Native Life > Native Issues Lawsuit would let Sioux take money for Black Hills Lawsuit would let Sioux take money for Black Hills

Reply LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 06-09-2009, 07:13 PM   #121
Self-Righteous Injun
 
Zeke's Avatar
 
Items Treasure ChestPresentTreasure ChestPresent
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Lewiston, ID
Posts: 2,447
Credits: 17,980.51
Savings: 1.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wangi Chetan View Post
Look at the corrupt tribal governments and how well their relatives live while the rest go hungry and cold. More money = more corruption because it will only intensify the greed.
Are you, seriously, making such a backward argument? The status of corruption isn't tied to a commodity, it's tied to humanity. If the only thing that you have to skim from is milk and corn, that's what gets skimmed.

Besides, right now, the allowed commodity -- in terms of $$$ -- is ZERO. Thusly, anything is an improvement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wangi Chetan View Post
...The real issue here is between the traditional and non traditional. Traditional believers are aware of the two sacred hides that reveal the Lakota Star Knowledge...
One wonders when these hides were created. Were the Lakota soulless heathens prior to their annexation of the Black Hills and the arrival of these hides? When, precisely, did that occur? Or, were there other hides that dictated behavior prior to the Black Hills, when the Lakota were "connected" to some OTHER land?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wangi Chetan View Post
You can pass judgment on the Lakota’s decision to refuse the money based on spiritual beliefs but you get your own feathers ruffled when others question you on your spiritual beliefs. Why is that???
Oh, please. My feathers have never been ruffled related to anything that I believe, spiritually, but I will tell you this: I'd bet God is more concerned with the Lakota's connection with God, then he is with their connection to God's land.

God's got LOTS of land, just as he did long BEFORE the Lakota migrated to the Black Hills and started painting on hides.

A BILLION dollars doesn't change who/what you are, it just makes you more so. If you're saying there'd be corruption, you're saying the Lakota are corrupt people. In general, there's nothing wrong with making such an argument, other than blaming the $$$: because it's not the catalyst.

The catalyst is having no Vision, and that's caused by living in a romanticized past, tied to an inanimate object/idol, with nothing but Darwin's Natural Selection to look forward to.

Again, GROW UP.

Martyrdom isn't "traditional."
Zeke is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 06-29-2009, 09:43 PM   #122
Pow Wow Visitor
 
LaughingWaterWI's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: WI
Posts: 513
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
Hmmm WHAT IS IT WITH ThEsE wIsE GuYs?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe's Dad View Post
My opinion is that your opinions suck. If it's the Lakota Oyate's decision to keep the land, your opinion and my opinion are moot. Do you only hate Lakotas, or is this how you feel about all NDNs who stay NDN and don't 'succeed'?

You sure like to YELL a lot!

You still didn't answer the question... Whose ideologies do you follow so you don't get killed?
Every where I read threads these two Characters never concider anyones thought. LOL INJUN SOldier AFRAID OF PINE RIDGE LOL. Zeke he says take the money. hmmmmmm some people are sellouts and some are not. I would never make an agreement to take the money crap they already owe $47 Billion dollars for land. So if you were to get this money when do these to" know it all's" think WHEN that will happen? In the year 6666? LOL sitting on your brains leaves no room for intelligence....I couldnot help but post this It's a personal family thing. I have relatives over that way Money is not the answer it was all your land it was stolen from the Lakota and oh talk about the battles well that seems to be none of nobodys biz. Besides people all throuh out the midwest before the euro came we were fine. who instigated the wars?
LaughingWaterWI is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 06-29-2009, 10:13 PM   #123
Pow Wow Visitor
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
dreamseeker has much to be proud ofdreamseeker has much to be proud ofdreamseeker has much to be proud ofdreamseeker has much to be proud ofdreamseeker has much to be proud ofdreamseeker has much to be proud ofdreamseeker has much to be proud ofdreamseeker has much to be proud of
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 14
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
Just left the rez in SD and the chiefs are in agreement--don't take the money. It's their decision so the rest is just opinion.
dreamseeker is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 06-29-2009, 10:16 PM   #124
Pow Wow Visitor
 
LaughingWaterWI's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: WI
Posts: 513
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe's Dad View Post
Yeah, I guess you did answer my question...Whose ideologies do you follow so you don't get killed?

So, by your words, this is what I get out of your history lesson. First, your people make peace with the french, then the british come in, kick some french a$$es and take over. So your people see this and crawl over to the british.

Then, the british get their A$$ kicked by the USofA, and your people think they can live in utopia with their neighbors to the south. So now your people crawl to the USA, but find out they're a bunch of liars, so they crawl back to the british. However, by your words, your people got screwed, they took your land and sold it to white people.

What you have stated, by your words, is your people have signed treaties with three different white groups...four different times..., got screwed every time.

This is what I get out of your ideologies...natives who understood that peace and happiness come through reconciliation and brotherhood!

The more I try to understand your logic...the more I like the Lakota's and Apache's thinking!!! They didn't roll over.

And you call yourself a warrior. Go sign another treaty.

Yep, this is my opinion...and we realize we don't agree with everything.
Hi this just is another example of imperialism and domination, I'm the King your a pagan attitude =white assimilation, ha ha you lost I won bla bla bla , have to say tho he's trying very hard to convince the Lakota to take the money.
I could not help posting this one from IlnuSoldier;
Notice how he refers to me using God WELL for one thing, I never mentioned GOD in none of my posts LOL this guy is Delusional or in denial?????And get this>>> kind a puts the frosting on the crap he claims the "Annishinabe are a western branch on of the Ilnu people...(Montagnais,Mi'kmaw, Cree, Innu, etc.) .. or, what the whites call "The Great Algonquin Complex"....
I'D Like to see where he got his history lesson from LOL Now he's telling me where i'm from, good grief whats next?????

Here is what he wants me to conform to
Laughing - Just to let you know--- you're also on my shyt list because you used "God" as you response to "who gives you the right" ?

There is no God in the ancient religion-- you do know that right? The Annishinabe did not have 'Gitchi Manitu" until after the influence of White Christians ?

You Annishinabe are a western branch on of the Ilnu people...(Montagnais,Mi'kmaw, Cree, Innu, etc.) .. or, what the whites call "The Great Algonquin Complex"....

Point is..

.. in your "original" (read : Actual Traditional) religion... you had "Manitu"..which meant "Nature of Things"..

..and it was a hellova lot complex and hard to actualize than a simple Anthropomorphic Deity..


So do yourself a favor--- and before you start all this jive shyt about traditions and frauds..

.. why don't you go and find out the actual definition of Manitu..

... and then you can cast your stones.

Honestly---- using a White/Christianized hybrid religion's ideology to combat the hybridization of traditional religions...

... is not only silly... but simply illogical and contradictory.

In otherwords, you cannot use one hybrid religion's material to try to disprove the value of hybrid religions. The only way you can use a hybrid religion t disprove hybrid religions is if the one you are using is being used as "An example of fault"--- which you are not. You are using your hybrid religion as "an example of Quality"... which makes your entire logic fall apart and you have nothing to stand on... and thus, nobody will listen to you or consider your words with much attention.

So...clean your thinking up and then, by all means, re-enter the fray.

Last edited by LaughingWaterWI; 06-29-2009 at 10:21 PM..
LaughingWaterWI is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 06-29-2009, 11:07 PM   #125
Self-Righteous Injun
 
Zeke's Avatar
 
Items Treasure ChestPresentTreasure ChestPresent
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Lewiston, ID
Posts: 2,447
Credits: 17,980.51
Savings: 1.00
The reality, LaughingWaterWI, is that you're just not very bright: you cannot even perceive as far out as the end of your own nose.

And, for the record, it is NOT the "Chief's" decision (to make), it's the the Peoples. When they have enough moxie to start truly asking why they are in difficulty, they'll look inward and to their leaders, not the past.

If you don't support growth, you're not ready to lead, be lead, or evolve. (Just like LaughingWaterWI.) This isn't hard to understand, when/if you're not afraid to actually live.
Zeke is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 06-29-2009, 11:10 PM   #126
Self-Righteous Injun
 
Zeke's Avatar
 
Items Treasure ChestPresentTreasure ChestPresent
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Lewiston, ID
Posts: 2,447
Credits: 17,980.51
Savings: 1.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaughingWaterWI View Post
sitting on your brains leaves no room for [COLOR=black][FONT=Arial]intelligence....
But it DOES mean that you, "have a brain." This is more than could -- ever -- be said for you.
Zeke is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 06-30-2009, 04:44 AM   #127
Honey Connoissuer
 
Blackbear's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Blackbear has a reputation beyond repute
Blackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Alaska
Posts: 9,817
Credits: 546.23
Savings: 1.00
Zeke your posts are treading on that line of "personal attacks"... tone it down or stop it alltogether before the dreaded ban is put on you. You've come this far without having to completly show your derrier, let's keep it that way.
__________________
Don't worry that it's not good enough for anyone else to hear... just sing, sing a song.
Blackbear is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 06-30-2009, 12:18 PM   #128
Nurture The Children
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Wangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 52
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
[.QUOTE=Zeke;1314765]The reality, LaughingWaterWI, is that you're just not very bright: you cannot even perceive as far out as the end of your own nose.

And, for the record, it is NOT the "Chief's" decision (to make), it's the the Peoples. When they have enough moxie to start truly asking why they are in difficulty, they'll look inward and to their leaders, not the past.

If you don't support growth, you're not ready to lead, be lead, or evolve. (Just like LaughingWaterWI.) This isn't hard to understand, when/if you're not afraid to actually live.[/QUOTE]

No Chief do not decide for the people but for many of us they still stand as an example of "good decision makers". A Chief is only a Chief if we agree and follow their example. Just because you do not PLEASE do not belittle others for their personal choices. I do not agree with your opinion but I respect you and your right to make your own choices. Please give that same respect to this young woman.

You said, "One wonders when these hides were created. Were the Lakota soulless heathens prior to their annexation of the Black Hills and the arrival of these hides? When, precisely, did that occur? Or, were there other hides that dictated behavior prior to the Black Hills, when the Lakota were "connected" to some OTHER land?"

You ask questions about hides that predate the time of calendars so I can not answer the question of "date". So you are arguing that a spiritual connect to the Black Hills has less value because they may have lived some where prior to coming to he Black Hills? I have a very strong spiritual connection to "Paradise" the land of my Sundance. Prior to making my Sundance pledge and dancing my first four years this spiritual connection to this land did not exist BUT that fact does not diminish my spiritual connection to that land.
__________________
Nurture The Children is dedicated to nurturing through nature. Sharing the love and respect of Mother Earth, Father Shy, and all those who walk, swim, fly and grow upon Her with the children of Her environment.

I am but one leaf on the Tree of Life.
Wangi Chetan is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 06-30-2009, 12:24 PM   #129
Pow Wow Visitor
 
LaughingWaterWI's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: WI
Posts: 513
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
Well Said..and..very true

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wangi Chetan View Post
I see much truth in your thoughts:
There is no division between spiritual and everyday…IF you have been taught the spiritual life-ways. Historical Trauma research is opening our understanding of how to do that.

First we must use action not words to make any kind of change.

Second we must realize that there are two kinds of NDN’s in any given community.
Apples and Tomatoes
Apples grow high up on the tree and are clean and shinny.

Tomatoes grow close to the ground and sometimes get a little dusty and dirty.

The real difference is seen when you cut them open:
Apples are only red on the outside with only a few seeds.
Tomatoes are red all the way through and are full of the seeds of knowledge, truth and wisdom.

SO WHAT CAUSED THIS HUGE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE APPLES AND TOMATOES?

The assimilation policies; 1887 Dawes Allotment Act, 1924 Indian Citizenship Act, 1950’s Termination policy, 1950’s Voluntary Relocation Program, and boarding schools…all took there toll. Parents can not teach their children what they were not taught. We must reley on the Elders who still hold on to this knowledge. All knowledge belongs to the children and we must begin to pass it down.

Research evidence shows that changes in parenting behaviors over time have placed the NDN children at risk for developing alcohol and/or substance abuse.

To teach the children we must first teach the parents. By creating a new self image of who they are as an NDN…by passing all the stereotypes…we can rebuild strong communities “one brick at a time” (one human being at a time). The devastation of loosing so many children is wakening many to the reality that we “must take action”.

I started by learning how we function within society and the social dysfunctions found on Indian Reservations. I felt like I was swimming against the tide. I felt that making any headway into correcting the social dysfunctions found on Rosebud would be light-years away. Now I can see the light at the end of the tunnel, I have read Brave Hearts research and others that show promise.

The answer is not easy but it starts by using fewer words and more action.
We must learn to forgive the unforgivable, for until we do we can not heal and move forward raising a new generation of TOMATOES.

Check out Breave Heart's research, it helped me see the possibilities. We can not be detered by hard work.
Can't help but to add to your great post.
I don't ask people WHY they don't understand us anymore. Fact is >We know what our ancestors went through, we know that these issues still exsist. We also know that we are Different in our way of thinking, Different in the way we live, Different in the way we are treated, Different in the way we view time. Different in our scared relgion, Different in how we treat our elders, children , women and men. It is not easy to explain. Maybe it's something we should stop trying to do. When you are brought up to respect these scared things like the medicine wheel, our drum ect'. Chi Miigwitch for a very wel stated comment.
LaughingWaterWI is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 06-30-2009, 12:32 PM   #130
Pow Wow Visitor
 
LaughingWaterWI's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: WI
Posts: 513
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamseeker View Post
Just left the rez in SD and the chiefs are in agreement--don't take the money. It's their decision so the rest is just opinion.
Well maybe I should clarify every word I type, because a certain person finds it amusing to twist things out of order. Of course it is the people who do not want the money dah.I thought everyone realized that it's not the just the chief..but yes I understand what you are saying.
LaughingWaterWI is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 06-30-2009, 01:02 PM   #131
Pow Wow Visitor
 
LaughingWaterWI's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: WI
Posts: 513
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wangi Chetan View Post
[.QUOTE=Zeke;1314765]The reality, LaughingWaterWI, is that you're just not very bright: you cannot even perceive as far out as the end of your own nose.

And, for the record, it is NOT the "Chief's" decision (to make), it's the the Peoples. When they have enough moxie to start truly asking why they are in difficulty, they'll look inward and to their leaders, not the past.

If you don't support growth, you're not ready to lead, be lead, or evolve. (Just like LaughingWaterWI.) This isn't hard to understand, when/if you're not afraid to actually live.
No Chief do not decide for the people but for many of us they still stand as an example of "good decision makers". A Chief is only a Chief if we agree and follow their example. Just because you do not PLEASE do not belittle others for their personal choices. I do not agree with your opinion but I respect you and your right to make your own choices. Please give that same respect to this young woman.

You said, "One wonders when these hides were created. Were the Lakota soulless heathens prior to their annexation of the Black Hills and the arrival of these hides? When, precisely, did that occur? Or, were there other hides that dictated behavior prior to the Black Hills, when the Lakota were "connected" to some OTHER land?"

You ask questions about hides that predate the time of calendars so I can not answer the question of "date". So you are arguing that a spiritual connect to the Black Hills has less value because they may have lived some where prior to coming to he Black Hills? I have a very strong spiritual connection to "Paradise" the land of my Sundance. Prior to making my Sundance pledge and dancing my first four years this spiritual connection to this land did not exist BUT that fact does not diminish my spiritual connection to that land.[/QUOTE]

Lakota wise words webite.. these words are from men with great wisdom they knew nothing of the value of money, they were survivors of what nature provided them
. "The earth is a part our body, and we never gave up the earth" Tohoolhoolzote,Wallowa Prophet, 1877
In many of our hearts we still carry the rememberance of our ancestors to throw it away would be like living in a world with no sun.
LaughingWaterWI is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 07-01-2009, 02:07 AM   #132
Self-Righteous Injun
 
Zeke's Avatar
 
Items Treasure ChestPresentTreasure ChestPresent
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Lewiston, ID
Posts: 2,447
Credits: 17,980.51
Savings: 1.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaughingWaterWI View Post
"The earth is a part our body, and we never gave up the earth" Tohoolhoolzote,Wallowa Prophet, 1877 [/I]
YOU ALREADY HAVE.

In addition, for the record, pointing out the obvious flaws in argument, and how those flaws permeate the very existence of the person espousing them, is NOT a, "personal attack." (Further, so they don't propagate, it is our duty to lay bare their inadequacies.)

This is just where we are. If their obvious intellectual beating about the head and shoulders causes shudders, perhaps they should rework their theories into something that makes sense.
Zeke is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 07-01-2009, 04:48 AM   #133
Honey Connoissuer
 
Blackbear's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Blackbear has a reputation beyond repute
Blackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond reputeBlackbear has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Alaska
Posts: 9,817
Credits: 546.23
Savings: 1.00
Pointing out what you percieve as flaws in the argument, correct is not a personal attack... HOWEVER, name calling, and the type of belittling you have been doing is along the lines of personal attack. And it is no one's duty to point out another's inadequacies, flaws, or intelligence level.... that is strictly for your own amusement. Kinda like pointing out a leg missing on a three legged dog.. what use is there in it?

I'm not saying you have to be nice or acknowlege another poster here, but reign it in and be civil. Being of such superior intelligence I should'nt have to even tell you to do so.
__________________
Don't worry that it's not good enough for anyone else to hear... just sing, sing a song.
Blackbear is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 07-01-2009, 10:03 AM   #134
Nurture The Children
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Wangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 52
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackbear View Post
Pointing out what you percieve as flaws in the argument, correct is not a personal attack... HOWEVER, name calling, and the type of belittling you have been doing is along the lines of personal attack. And it is no one's duty to point out another's inadequacies, flaws, or intelligence level.... that is strictly for your own amusement. Kinda like pointing out a leg missing on a three legged dog.. what use is there in it?

I'm not saying you have to be nice or acknowlege another poster here, but reign it in and be civil. Being of such superior intelligence I should'nt have to even tell you to do so.
Well stated! Good post and written with respect.
__________________
Nurture The Children is dedicated to nurturing through nature. Sharing the love and respect of Mother Earth, Father Shy, and all those who walk, swim, fly and grow upon Her with the children of Her environment.

I am but one leaf on the Tree of Life.
Wangi Chetan is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 07-01-2009, 10:15 AM   #135
Nurture The Children
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Wangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 52
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
Originally Posted by LaughingWaterWI
"The earth is a part our body, and we never gave up the earth" Tohoolhoolzote,Wallowa Prophet, 1877 [/I]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeke View Post
YOU ALREADY HAVE.
YOU MAY HAVE!!
But you can not speak for me or others. What our anscestors did in secret we are now free to once again do in the open. I personally will never give up the earth and I dedicate my life to educating our children about how to respect the gifts of our Earth Mother.
__________________
Nurture The Children is dedicated to nurturing through nature. Sharing the love and respect of Mother Earth, Father Shy, and all those who walk, swim, fly and grow upon Her with the children of Her environment.

I am but one leaf on the Tree of Life.
Wangi Chetan is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 07-01-2009, 10:40 AM   #136
Self-Righteous Injun
 
Zeke's Avatar
 
Items Treasure ChestPresentTreasure ChestPresent
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Lewiston, ID
Posts: 2,447
Credits: 17,980.51
Savings: 1.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackbear View Post
Being of such superior intelligence I should'nt have to even tell you to do so.
"Along the lines of," does NOT qualify (as a personal attack). And it IS our duty to eradicate missives that hold us back.

That said, I find your post very humorous.

NICE.
Zeke is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 07-01-2009, 10:41 AM   #137
Self-Righteous Injun
 
Zeke's Avatar
 
Items Treasure ChestPresentTreasure ChestPresent
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Zeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond reputeZeke has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Lewiston, ID
Posts: 2,447
Credits: 17,980.51
Savings: 1.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wangi Chetan View Post
YOU MAY HAVE!!
No, we ALL have. Whether we wanted to, or not.

In sum, it's not your land.

That's just the Real World.
Zeke is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 07-01-2009, 02:27 PM   #138
Pow Wow Visitor
 
LaughingWaterWI's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: WI
Posts: 513
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeke View Post
Are you, seriously, making such a backward argument? The status of corruption isn't tied to a commodity, it's tied to humanity. If the only thing that you have to skim from is milk and corn, that's what gets skimmed.

Besides, right now, the allowed commodity -- in terms of $$$ -- is ZERO. Thusly, anything is an improvement.



One wonders when these hides were created. Were the Lakota soulless heathens prior to their annexation of the Black Hills and the arrival of these hides? When, precisely, did that occur? Or, were there other hides that dictated behavior prior to the Black Hills, when the Lakota were "connected" to some OTHER land?



Oh, please. My feathers have never been ruffled related to anything that I believe, spiritually, but I will tell you this: I'd bet God is more concerned with the Lakota's connection with God, then he is with their connection to God's land.

God's got LOTS of land, just as he did long BEFORE the Lakota migrated to the Black Hills and started painting on hides.

A BILLION dollars doesn't change who/what you are, it just makes you more so. If you're saying there'd be corruption, you're saying the Lakota are corrupt people. In general, there's nothing wrong with making such an argument, other than blaming the $$$: because it's not the catalyst.

The catalyst is having no Vision, and that's caused by living in a romanticized past, tied to an inanimate object/idol, with nothing but Darwin's Natural Selection to look forward to.

Again, GROW UP.

Martyrdom isn't "traditional."
Oh, please. My feathers have never been ruffled related to anything that I believe, spiritually, but I will tell you this: I'd bet God is more concerned with the Lakota's connection with God, and then he is with their connection to God's land.

How much you wana bet you can’t tell about how Your Assumptions about God is more concerned with the Lakota connection with God than he is with the connection to Gods Land? In who’s book Zeke? Under what presumption? So why ,God would be more concerned about the Lakota Connection with God, rather than anyone else’s?
LaughingWaterWI is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 07-01-2009, 02:36 PM   #139
Pow Wow Visitor
 
LaughingWaterWI's Avatar
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
LaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond reputeLaughingWaterWI has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: WI
Posts: 513
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
No you said it's Gods Land

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeke View Post
No, we ALL have. Whether we wanted to, or not.

In sum, it's not your land.

That's just the Real World.
"God's got LOTS of land, just as he did long BEFORE the Lakota migrated to the Black Hills and started painting on hides."

So who's land is it Gods or the Federal Governments? LOL
So when did God sign a treaty with the Federal Government? Sounds kinda wierd to me but that is the picture you paint. Hey does anyone out there have any hides they can give to Zeke????




LaughingWaterWI is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Old 07-02-2009, 12:58 AM   #140
Nurture The Children
 
User InfoThanks / Tagging InfoGifts / Achievements / AwardsvBActivity Stats
Wangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond reputeWangi Chetan has a reputation beyond repute
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 52
Credits: 0.00
Savings: 0.00
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeke View Post
No, we ALL have. Whether we wanted to, or not.

In sum, it's not your land.

That's just the Real World.
You seem to have forgotten "The earth does not belong to us
we belong to the land" and for one have not nor never will forget that.

Giving up the land in your view is a physical event
But for me it is spiritual.

The real world is that we must choose money over spiritual belief.
__________________
Nurture The Children is dedicated to nurturing through nature. Sharing the love and respect of Mother Earth, Father Shy, and all those who walk, swim, fly and grow upon Her with the children of Her environment.

I am but one leaf on the Tree of Life.
Wangi Chetan is offline   Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Sponsored Links
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Baby Names - Here we go again NDNQt Chit Chat 30 05-19-2008 03:45 PM

    

Join the online community forum celebrating Native American Culture, Pow Wows, tribes, music, art, and history.

Join PowWows.com Today!

Your Guide to Native American Pow Wows Since 1996

Register For Free

Enjoy the benefits of being a member of PowWows.com!

Join our Native American online community focused on Pow Wow singing, dancing, crafts, Native American music, Native American videos, and more.

Add your Pow Wow to our Calendar

Share your photos and videos

Play games, enter contests, and much more!






New Threads

Pow Wow Calendar Search

 
Month: Year:

Location:

Videos

Featured Articles

Dance Styles

Crafts

Gallery