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Old 03-18-2006, 07:54 AM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direct_Effect
Since growing up, I have always been told to learn the traditions and language of our people. My parents have instilled this into me, as their parents instilled into them. They also told me to always marry another Native...another Indian. If I don't, then my kids would lose any Indian blood. This has always been a sort of mantra for me while growing up.

My parents are not racists, or they wouldn't have let me date other people outside my own race, but to marry someone outside my own race is another thing. For them, you should always try and keep the "blood." Otherwise, our tribal heritage ( from a small tribe) would die out.

Looking at other natives inter-marrying other races, their kids have it hard. They are grown into mixed blood. Think of generations ahead, their offspring will be considered the 1/200 blood quantum.

Who let these things happens? We do. Is it the offsprings' fault? I think not.

It all starts with us...the first people. We let ourselves get mixed up.

I can understand that sometimes we cannot help who we fall in love (or lust), but in reality I think it does.

Would you want your future generations to say they are 1/200th degree?

Think about it.
you are right if we go outside our race then there will be none left but think of it this way if everyone marries outside their race then we will ALL be the same just as it was back in the time of our fathers. I am a half breed and it is very hard but you should not change your mind on marrying someone outside your race just because they are different. This is the way i have been taught and is what i belive in.
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Old 03-18-2006, 09:10 AM   #102
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Me as a non-involved...

I have not learnt any culture, there is no real German culture.
You can be very very proud of your culture, languages and what YOU are.
And be proud of your history, too.
America should do more for you Natives! I cannot understand this. Germans cannot understand what happens-happened. And we know only a tiny little bit...
And I think these problems are causing more problems with your blood-problem.
If I were you, I would look out for the love of my life only among Indians- probably all tribes. If I were a mixture (well, I am a mixture, too ;-)) I would do the same, keep my culture or marry somebody who can teach me and our children. You know what is the most important thing to you. And knowing this, there could be more problems...fighting or pointing at not-full-blood-NDNs.
Even if American politics often seems to fight against the real owners of America, and often still does,
PLEASE do not fight against each other!
Who is more worth than the other for me is not the question. Same creator. Education, family, school, politics,...,...may have a very big influence on your selfrespect.
My Opinion:
No mathematics can prove how much NDN is in you. You are getting a raw deal.

But this is all written by a non-involved.
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Old 03-18-2006, 12:09 PM   #103
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...#102...
if you mind me being here in this forum or
if you feel disturbed by me,
please
delete #102 or
send me a PM and I will delete it,
because I don't want to be inpolite...
I just don't know unwritten (and written) rules.
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Old 03-18-2006, 10:32 PM   #104
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Boozhoo niji,

I do not know how long this thread has been going on for, but I see it now and am moved to write something in here.

I myself agree with the original post, that the blood is gradually thinning, it has been ever since the white man has set foot in this land. I am proof of this myself, my blood is only 1/16th Ojibwe. So I am in a bit of a predicamnet.

If I seek love with a white woman, then I continue to thin our blood. On the otherhand if I find someone full or half Ojibwe, then I thin that blood. For me its a kind of a no win situation.

Love is spontanious. That is what got us all into this prediciment in the first place. Whether it was the Vikings ravishing our women 800 years ago, or our people falling in love with whites, it was this spontinuity from either side that produced the first half breeds and started this rollercoaster, and it is one that will never stop.

We can sit forever and question could of, should of, would of, but its a waste of time. There is no turning back so why look back. We must look forward to what will best strengthen our cultures. For me, that is learning our traditions and our language. When I look for love, I look for a woman that will support me in that search, no matter what color she is. If she is full blooded Ojibwe and will not support my dancing or my passion for learning tradition, then I have no use for someone like that in my life.

My search for love might just be a fruitless one, but my search for tradition will be one of fulfillment.

Derek
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Old 03-19-2006, 12:27 AM   #105
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I can see both sides of this arguement. But I have just one question (no offense):

Those who wouldn't/couldn't marry a non-native, what makes you different from people like the "new" Klan or the neo-Nazis who want to preserve the Aryan race? Wouldn't their views on interracial mixing be the same as yours? (no offense again).
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Old 03-19-2006, 01:46 AM   #106
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I want to say that I married a Wonderful Lipan(Apache) /Azteca woman. Our Children(4 of them) are registered Lipan. Had I married a Cherokee or an Osage the kids could be of a stronger BQ in these Tribes.

I know of NDN friends that are 1/4 or less of many different Tribes. If these Tribes were to require 1/4 or more BQ these friends and there children would be #### out of luck. I have a good friend( like a brother) who is 7/16 Southern Cheyene. He married a non-NDN. She is great (as long as she has her morning Pepsi) and a good partner. The problem is that the Southern Cheyene don't recognise their kids because the kids aren't 1/4 or better. This BQ is a Government thing and the Tribes are falling into the catch of things. If the Tribes just allowed heritage instead of BQ this blood thing would not be a topic.
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Old 03-19-2006, 06:32 AM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TradJingle
I can see both sides of this arguement. But I have just one question (no offense):

Those who wouldn't/couldn't marry a non-native, what makes you different from people like the "new" Klan or the neo-Nazis who want to preserve the Aryan race? Wouldn't their views on interracial mixing be the same as yours? (no offense again).
...only a few words:
Most German Neo-Nazis are still children without a proper education, high criminal thinking,...
When I walk along the road, I can be attacked by 10 or more of those sick ones. That's why I have to learn self- defence like Wing Tsun Kung Fu!!! They are kicking your head without knowing you, while you are lying on the ground, not able to move one finger!!!
...I hope, you will never compare them again to any other groups...to me they are tooooooo different.

Best wishes...

Silvia from Germany.

Forward: 'Arier' calling themselves 'Arier' think they are the best human beings, the others are not worth called human beings. They have no culture and no languages and they were not treaten bad. They are treating other folks bad. They poisoned babies and children with gas or they are providing this. (Hope you can understand my English)

Last edited by indian-heart-beat; 03-19-2006 at 06:41 AM.. Reason: Forward...
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Old 03-20-2006, 12:43 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indian-heart-beat
...only a few words:
Most German Neo-Nazis are still children without a proper education, high criminal thinking,...
When I walk along the road, I can be attacked by 10 or more of those sick ones. That's why I have to learn self- defence like Wing Tsun Kung Fu!!! They are kicking your head without knowing you, while you are lying on the ground, not able to move one finger!!!
...I hope, you will never compare them again to any other groups...to me they are tooooooo different.

Best wishes...

Silvia from Germany.

Forward: 'Arier' calling themselves 'Arier' think they are the best human beings, the others are not worth called human beings. They have no culture and no languages and they were not treaten bad. They are treating other folks bad. They poisoned babies and children with gas or they are providing this. (Hope you can understand my English)
I hear you, but that wasn't my point. I'm comparing the people I'm comparing their views.
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Old 03-20-2006, 11:34 PM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TradJingle
I can see both sides of this arguement. But I have just one question (no offense):

Those who wouldn't/couldn't marry a non-native, what makes you different from people like the "new" Klan or the neo-Nazis who want to preserve the Aryan race? Wouldn't their views on interracial mixing be the same as yours? (no offense again).
u know...when that kid up at red lake went shooting kids in school...i looked a bit into his way of thinking...they said he went up on a socialist site...where the majority were white people who were about not mixing races...alot of people thought they were skinheads, racists, kkk, etc..and maybe some of them are...but to my understanding and i could be wrong....they jus want to keep their bloodlines pure...they don't want inter-racial anything...and if i'm not mistaken, its not about...superiority...but alot of people turn it into that...
maybe i'm off, but thats the impression i got from reading that kids posts as well as other ndnz who posted on there and some of the white people also...
i don't think its racist to want to marry within ur own tribe...or to marry only a ndn...its a preference...i prefer pespi over coke...i don't go sayin i hate coke...i'd wait for a pespi before i take a coke tho lol...
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Old 03-21-2006, 05:32 AM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wannabeUrNo1Snag
u know...when that kid up at red lake went shooting kids in school...i looked a bit into his way of thinking...they said he went up on a socialist site...where the majority were white people who were about not mixing races...alot of people thought they were skinheads, racists, kkk, etc..and maybe some of them are...but to my understanding and i could be wrong....they jus want to keep their bloodlines pure...they don't want inter-racial anything...and if i'm not mistaken, its not about...superiority...but alot of people turn it into that...
maybe i'm off, but thats the impression i got from reading that kids posts as well as other ndnz who posted on there and some of the white people also...
i don't think its racist to want to marry within ur own tribe...or to marry only a ndn...its a preference...i prefer pespi over coke...i don't go sayin i hate coke...i'd wait for a pespi before i take a coke tho lol...
And yet it's a site like that one that both the kid from Red Lake and the Columbine kids both read before they went in and shot up their school...

No it's not racist to want your people to marry within their race or tribe, but some folks get hateful about it and intolerant, and in some cases go to the extreme with it like those kids.
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Old 03-21-2006, 05:50 AM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gache
Exactly now try to open your mind a little. Culture is not things like a pc but a way of thinking when most of the people in your family are white your probably going to think white which clearly shows what your doing.
You know actually... what will preserve the culture is folks not leaving the community. I know plenty of full blooded indians out there who's parents left the rez a long time ago and never even bothered to bring their kids back to visit family. They learn about their culture later in life but it does'nt have the same meaning to them as those that are raised in the community, or have even been around it for short periods of time. Culture's base roots are community.
Race is a myth plain and simple. Our wonderful brown features and such came from living on this land and environment and intermarrying each other for thousands of years and nothing more. I don't want to see those features disappear myself because I think they are beautiful, but dang folks.. chit happens and there is more than one type of people living here now on this continent.
And as far as keeping it within your own tribe as well... oh heck, who knows for certain that the blood has always just been this or that nation. Each nation assimilated captives and orphans or married from another nation and the nation adopted them in as their own... even broke off from other nations to start their own. Down to the nitty gritty there is not such thing as a pure blood anything.
I married my best friend. Someone with like interests, similar background, similar goals and sense of humor. He's not full blood and he's not tuscarora but he's perfect, I love him and can't imagine life without him.
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Old 03-21-2006, 05:53 AM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Originally Posted By: TradJingle
I can see both sides of this arguement. But I have just one question (no offense):

Those who wouldn't/couldn't marry a non-native, what makes you different from people like the "new" Klan or the neo-Nazis who want to preserve the Aryan race? Wouldn't their views on interracial mixing be the same as yours? (no offense again).
Big difference ... one is trying to preserve blood and culture, the other wanted to annihilate all other races/cultures.
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Old 03-21-2006, 07:23 AM   #113
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Yes, yes, yes!!!

Blackbear,

thank you so much for finding better words
I was not able to find
because of my language!

This will be clear for everybody, now. (Hope so)

If I had culture, I would love to keep it alive.
When we are losing something we love-without knowing about our love yet-it may be too late do get it back forever. It is gone forever and always. My opinion. Maybe Im too old ;-)
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Old 03-21-2006, 02:23 PM   #114
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Holy Crap! How did I miss this thread back from 04? LOL

I just want to say that, I am 1/2 blood, born and raised on the rez. I was taught our ways, not our language as only a few people were fluent in Potawatomi. You are right, you can't help who you fall in love with but I grew up with my family telling me to marry native to keep the bloodlines and I agree with it. Does that make me any different than an African American person who will only date their race and have kids who will be "proud" African Americans? Does it make it make me different than an Asian American who will only date their race? All the races have people like us and we are all entitled to how we want to live and who and what we want to date. You have blonde, white girls who will only date black guys, you have black girls who will only date white guys and vice versa.

It doesn't make me any different from all those other races to think like I do as they were taught by their families to keep their cultures and "blood" lines intact.

For me personally, I will marry and have children with a native of another tribe. I wish my kids could be full blood but because I am not full myself they will inherit 1/4 white from me. Which is fine but my idenity is native, always has been always will be. I never even admitted I was white until after I was in college for 2 years because I really never was told I was white growing up.

I will emphasize again..you can't help who you fall in love with but you can keep your options limited to what you want and if that means them being native...so be it.
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Old 05-05-2006, 10:45 PM   #115
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losing indian blood

Here is my 2 cents;
Being american indian is more than about blood ,it is a spiritual way of life.
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Old 05-05-2006, 11:10 PM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indian-heart-beat
...only a few words:
Most German Neo-Nazis are still children without a proper education, high criminal thinking,...
When I walk along the road, I can be attacked by 10 or more of those sick ones. That's why I have to learn self- defence like Wing Tsun Kung Fu!!! They are kicking your head without knowing you, while you are lying on the ground, not able to move one finger!!!
...I hope, you will never compare them again to any other groups...to me they are tooooooo different.

Best wishes...

Silvia from Germany.

Forward: 'Arier' calling themselves 'Arier' think they are the best human beings, the others are not worth called human beings. They have no culture and no languages and they were not treaten bad. They are treating other folks bad. They poisoned babies and children with gas or they are providing this. (Hope you can understand my English)
It's a funny thing here in the redneck mountains of Virginia. As a corrections officer, we have more blacks in our prison than others, latino's are picking up. Well here in the mountains, our mix can be anything. We have what we call mulugeans. They can be mixed with Native, black, or any other group who came here. Onced mixed, Old Virginia only counted white or black. So if you were mixed you claim white to vote and own land. The funny thing is that some rednecks here who hate blacks and others may well have some black blood in them from sometime back.
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Old 05-06-2006, 05:56 AM   #117
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Strange. Confusing.

So everybody wants to hide what or who he doesn't want to be?
I think it is a natural thing, for you cannot change your blood and heritage.

But are you less worth being a mix? Never! It is up to you to keep your selfrespect.
The 'only' problem I can see as an uninvolved German (well, a mix out of three nationalities *g* maybe more? Who knows???) is your political situation, law, justice, your rights , prejudice and stereotypes...and effects and consequences.

Okay, I can talk a lot. Some people recognize me as a mix at once, some don't. Situation in Germany is not like yours in the USA. We cannot really compare them.
I feel no shame being a mix. I hope you don't! What for! But sometimes I've got a feeling that I have to be stronger than others, that I have to 'defend' myself cause I feel attacked - so there must be something in my mind...;-)

You NDNs have a culture to keep and to save, even if you are mixed blood.

Only my opinion as a noninvolved.
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Old 05-06-2006, 08:26 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by Direct_Effect
Since growing up, I have always been told to learn the traditions and language of our people. My parents have instilled this into me, as their parents instilled into them. They also told me to always marry another Native...another Indian. If I don't, then my kids would lose any Indian blood. This has always been a sort of mantra for me while growing up.

My parents are not racists, or they wouldn't have let me date other people outside my own race, but to marry someone outside my own race is another thing. For them, you should always try and keep the "blood." Otherwise, our tribal heritage ( from a small tribe) would die out.

Looking at other natives inter-marrying other races, their kids have it hard. They are grown into mixed blood. Think of generations ahead, their offspring will be considered the 1/200 blood quantum.

Who let these things happens? We do. Is it the offsprings' fault? I think not.

It all starts with us...the first people. We let ourselves get mixed up.

I can understand that sometimes we cannot help who we fall in love (or lust), but in reality I think it does.

Would you want your future generations to say they are 1/200th degree?

Think about it.
To tell you the truth, I am a strong....full blood lakota woman, and I have never dated a man of my own race. I have always dated black men. I grew up on a reservation, and when I left I made a promise to myself that I would never live like those girls did and that the father of my child wouldn't be like your typical native rez man (no offense). My parents were the same way with me, and right now I do not have any children because I'm focused on how MY life is supposed to be....school, getting established in life, then marriage, and then children. When I do have children, I will teach them my ways, as I have been taught...I will take them around my family...I will involve them in our religion...but I can not guarantee that my kids will be full native like I am because I know that the father of my children...whomever it may be....will have goals, a career, and be able to support his child financially, emotionally, and physically!
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Old 05-06-2006, 10:38 PM   #119
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well i have to say that my beg'lings are 1/2 breeds...yes its true...i had unprotected wild and freaky sex with a WHITE guy...a whole buncha times even....i cant change the past...i have changed my way of thinking tho...i dont hate the color of my skin anymore...i even tan now lol..and i have my moments that i feel guilty that they arent full blooded like me...specially when its ndns that tease them ...i had them in a native skool....needless to say that didnt last long...ANYWAYZ im bored so:
-I want my children to have ndn babies...Sto:lo Ndn preferably...i have told them that again and again...in my family the younger generations kids are almost all halfbreeds, either white or black...if i teach them that crap about marryin for 'love' and they choose another race...then im guilty of playin a part in the Sto:lo people being EXTINCT..u know...as in gone forever....like the Dodo bird
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Old 05-06-2006, 11:21 PM   #120
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native blood

I am full...and proved! My children are full...and proved! and thats from a promise I made when I was 20, because I was proved of being a native women and too I had alot of resentment in my heart. I'm proved I kept my promise. My resentment is not as strong as it was than, I do have a bit of an open mind for all humans race. In all honesty, the native blood is running thin.
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