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Forum Home - Go Back > General > Native Life > Native Issues Should non-natives be allowed in native spiritual ceremonies? Should non-natives be allowed in native spiritual ceremonies?

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Old 02-06-2008, 01:00 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josiah View Post
The answer is, they already have been!
Exactly correct.
The reason for being there is the essence.
I feel all of the things I've witnessed in regards to spiritual ceremony (broadly defined ), I was put there for a purpose. I was invited by freinds/family for a purpose. The real reasons may not be fully known. For example, one the 7 Lakota rights, would qualify for this discussion. I would like to believe the family did not make a mistake in "making relations/family". Ceremonies have a place. They exist because the creator created them. Yes they must be protected from exploitation , but not from being passed down to future generations based on race. Faith is a thing of the mind and spirit not of blood quantum.
As a dancer who has travelled all over the country since I started in 1985. I have made SOLID friends all over. Naturally I've been invited to events not advertised or made public. I feelt honored and privileged to be Included.
Furthermore, many cultures around the world have any open doors attitude towards their faith. They believe it , they naturally share it with others.
As stated above, the native cultures have been sharing for over 400 years.
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Old 02-06-2008, 12:50 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by Josiah View Post
Wow tough question
But really it has been answered many times before
The answer is, they already have been!
Should they be???
it depends
Were they brought there?
Did they stumble onto it???

I have sat in on and been part of several ceremonies of my own tribe and of several others...

Should I have been included? Just because I was native? did this give me a free ticket to witness the ceremony?
Probably
Actually in all cases it was Family or friends that brought me in and I witnessed the ceremony.
So they took RESPONSIBILITY for me and my actions
It was explained what to do and not do and it went well

So I guess my answer is
It depends
Too often these folks are brought in and there Native Guides so to speak don't keep them from doing something stupid

Case in point I was going into a Tribal Area during a long week of a ceremony and there were HUGE Billboards that Stated in Clear and Precise Language that Photography of any sort is Prohibited!
And yet there were several that had there cameras confiscated and they made a big fuss about that!
I guess they did not think the sign meant them!!!

It depends
Do we take responsibility for our guests and make sure they understand what they are getting into and will they listen to you when you say enough and tell them its time to go!
Josiah, like I said in another thread, you are wise and I hope to meet you someday.
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Old 02-06-2008, 04:08 PM   #43
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I say NO. Except in rare cases. Like if a non-native is married into a family and it's the family's ceremony...ie...baby naming ceremony.

There are many kinds of ceremonies - EXCEPT powwows!!! But you could call what the color guard does a ceremony in the powwow. Would you invite a non-veteran to participate in the raising of the flags??

There are some ceremonies for tribes, some for clans, some for families, some for societies, some for men, some for women. Would you invite a woman into a men-only ceremony?

I think that native ceremonies need to be protected. There are some very sincere, respectful non-natives that can't wait to learn, participate, and possibly steal or corrupt a ceremony. Some where down the line when "playing ndn" loses its appeal, and doesn't it always sooner or later, they could "use" the ceremony for whatever purposes, ie. usually monetary....

So in general...NO.
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:20 PM   #44
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Well MOTS ?? You started the post because you needed help with your homework.. so how will your argument go????
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:33 PM   #45
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i now must write up my stance in a newspaper commentary form for the globe and mail....(im not actually writing it for the actual paper) but it has to look like that....i should have it done purty soon...ill post it here...megwitch everyone...
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:37 PM   #46
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Hi Mots, wanna attend an ndn ceremony w/ me? j/k good luck w/ the article.....
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:40 PM   #47
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does it involves no clothes and dancing in the forest during a full moon?
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:41 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by middle of the sky View Post
does it involves no clothes and dancing in the forest during a full moon?
Well, kind of like that but not during February! we had about 9" of snow last night too.....but you are on the right track.
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:43 PM   #49
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the one leading out of town...
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:44 PM   #50
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Hmmm where they smile and say the rooms are over there Mr.&Mrs. Jones!
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:45 PM   #51
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:47 PM   #52
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cool icon! looks like one of my ex girlfriends! Ok back to topic
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:49 PM   #53
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ill have FUN with formatting again...making columns and inserting a pic of me....then indents etc, etc....

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Old 02-07-2008, 08:53 PM   #54
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sounds cool, do post it here please...
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:56 PM   #55
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ok i have to run that article is not going to read itself..
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Old 02-07-2008, 10:36 PM   #56
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Crap.. someone here just blew my concentration and now I can't remember where I was going with this.. I'll come back to it later.
LMAO!!!! Preggo brain!!!!!
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Old 02-08-2008, 10:11 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by middle of the sky View Post
does it involves no clothes and dancing in the forest during a full moon?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe G View Post
Well, kind of like that but not during February! we had about 9" of snow last night too.....but you are on the right track.
And when you see an airplane flying over really slow and low, that will be a plane full of folks with cameras.
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Old 02-08-2008, 11:22 AM   #58
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Depending on the circumstance of the ceremony, I would say maybe. I know several tribes that keep their ceremonies private and not for non-natives to witness. I know the Pueblo Tribes have different ceremonies going on, and only a few of these ceremonies are seen by non-natives. The rest are strictly for tribal members or other invited natives. I'm sure there are other tribes who enforce their regulations, too.

Exploitation is a problem in these times, and it's best to keep our traditions solid and free from exploitation. Pow-wow is already out of our hands. I googled pow wow one day, and saw many fliers for pow-wows that were sponsored by Boy Scouts. I can only grin and bear it because it's become too much.

I used to work in the tourism industry, and I've seen countless people who come wanting to visit a chief or spiritual leader because they want to become more indian or get rid of some personal thing in their life.

I don't think being part native or whatever should be an issue here. I think if you have native blood, then you're native. That being said, I'm going to leave you all with a quote, "If God wanted us all to be Indian, he would have made us all Indian."
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Old 03-18-2008, 06:18 PM   #59
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alright mots..... so wheres this article?
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Old 03-18-2008, 09:06 PM   #60
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alright mots..... so wheres this article?
i changed my mind about it as i didnt have time to ask the people that are really were the authorities....-the elders-...i wrote about that racist video of the white chicks dancing instead...but thanks for everyones input.....maybe i will write that article but not now i have too much essays to write right now
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