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Old 02-20-2009, 02:17 PM   #181
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hahaha...my turn...

Yes..it is my turn to chime in

Most powwows are just rodeos, let us be honest about that... I mean.. ."Grand Entry" even...

However, the serious powwows are usually CLOSED off ---- so no "white people" there.

If you are at an open powwow (read : Rodeo), then you open yourself up for ANYONE to show up ... like a carnival.

When you mix a "sacred event" with a "commerical enterprise"... you are going to get this ackward situation where people who don't know about your "sacred ways" will show up and .... BY DEFINITION... will act in a profrane way.

What do you expect when your 'sacred circle' is surrounded by dozens and dozens of food and leather vendors ?

Every powwow that is not on rez and closed-- Will experience this situation.

However--- this is the time to educate the whites and to not get made at them..

Hell -- YOU INVITED THEM TO COME... so as the host, it is YOUR job to be patient and understanding.

If you dont' want to deal with them, then attend CLOSED powwows.

Don't ask them to come and spend their money and then get made at them for being who they are...

Again--- you invite them, it is your job to educate.

OMG... yep, I said it.
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Old 02-20-2009, 06:06 PM   #182
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I can see that powwows mix elements of a rodeo and a carnival. I don't know about the "sacredness", because most tribes have had social dancing - separate from ceremonies.

Most reservation powwows are not CLOSED. I don't know if I've ever heard of a closed powwow. It's true that lots will require a CDIB or tribal enrollment card to register for contests, but I've never heard of anyone being turned away from an intertribal - even hippy types.

I agree that whites need to be educated. Really, wouldn't it have been better if the whites that came to America were all assimilated to the native culture??
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Old 02-20-2009, 07:10 PM   #183
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I don't think any reasonable person expects whites to show up knowing everything. What makes people angry is when informed of proper behaviour many disregard what they were told (showing lack of respect) because it doesn't suit what they want. Second is when they just are plain disrespectful, by anyones definition.
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Old 02-20-2009, 07:43 PM   #184
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Certainly here in the Land of Powwows (Oklahoma)
I have never heard of a closed Powwow either...
Even Annual Celebrations that alot of the tribes down this way have are open to the public
I know of very few Ceremonies that if somebody asked could witness if they want
The curious Tourist is not really the problem for the most part keep to themselves and buy a few trinkets and leave

We have so many powwows so often that its really become passe' for alot of the tourists the small benefit powwows that are raising money for the big summer powwows dont typically have tourists or lookeeloos

The press can be a little pushy I was at a powwow on OU campus and they had some press from Bangladesh and they were right on the floor in among the dancers trying to get the best shots but the AD came over and politely asked them to stand aside they were holding up grand entry
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Old 02-24-2009, 09:02 PM   #185
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wyo rose : Yes.. in fact, many of the whites initially, in the Martimes, partially assimiliated to the native way ... this blending of the French with the Lnu people was, by all accounts, beautiful and worked well.
The problem came when the British DID NOT mix and chose to view natives as enemies rather than as potential family.


In terms of a closed powwows : Yea...I never heard of a closed powwow either... which was my point. So long as there are no closed powwows, people of all types will show up.

In that case, you can get idiots of any color.... not just whites.

You figure... the "sacred stuff" is held...well, usually...in secret... and the rodeo, I mean, powwow is a social event open to everybody..

It is not a "white" thing..more over it is an "American thing" or a "Western thing".. because again... you could have people of ANY race showing up and being a moron..

Hell, I've been to dozens of powwows where many native people were acting like unashamed idiots...

It just so happens that there are like... 500,000,000 million white people out there... and if 1 in every 20 people is an idiot... well.... that means there are about 25,000,000 million idiots out there...

The odds that a few of the 25 million idiots among the whites (which is only 5% of their popultation) might show up at a big rodeo---urgh, I mean powwow--- is pretty high.
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Old 02-25-2009, 02:13 PM   #186
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Hey, I LIKE rodeos.
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Old 06-20-2010, 10:16 PM   #187
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those wannabe vendors really annoy me. I usually walk around looking for a new beadwork set or some decent deerskin and supplies and here are some people selling IMPORTED beadwork for 25.00 when it only costs less and is worth dirt at competition. The real vendors are thinning out and here come those long hair wannabe with rabbit fur and plastic bead galore. Last powwow (Delta park) there was only one store which had the cut beads, and powwow bling i needed... and it was a big powwow..
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Old 06-21-2010, 04:12 AM   #188
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I've never been to a powwow where just anyone was allowed to get out and dance whenever they wanted so I'm not sure about all that. But then I don't think just any gathering of people wearing feathers qualifies as a powwow. Ever seen the "powwows" they have over in Russia? Now there's some funny.
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Old 06-22-2010, 01:22 AM   #189
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I've never been to a powwow where just anyone was allowed to get out and dance whenever they wanted so I'm not sure about all that. But then I don't think just any gathering of people wearing feathers qualifies as a powwow. Ever seen the "powwows" they have over in Russia? Now there's some funny.
There are some powwows or gatherings that are completely opened. But they are few and far between and usually not opened to the public. I've been to a few by invatation and there are no vendors or spectators and no grand entry. Just us singing and dancing in a social setting. Almost like a huge family picnic where there is table after table of food and the drums played whenever they felt the need.
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Old 06-22-2010, 11:05 AM   #190
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I can see that powwows mix elements of a rodeo and a carnival. I don't know about the "sacredness", because most tribes have had social dancing - separate from ceremonies.

Most reservation powwows are not CLOSED. I don't know if I've ever heard of a closed powwow. It's true that lots will require a CDIB or tribal enrollment card to register for contests, but I've never heard of anyone being turned away from an intertribal - even hippy types.

I agree that whites need to be educated. Really, wouldn't it have been better if the whites that came to America were all assimilated to the native culture??
Omg! That would have been a dream of mine come true! You don't know what its like to be a Heinz 57! All your life you are raised knowing you have (and I quote) 'Indian Blood". But told to shush. Not having anyone in your family willing to talk about it. It's like living your life with only half your limbs! An arm missing here, a leg there. Then you get old enough to research yourself, your true heritage, your ancestry, and you are hit from all sides! Your family, and others! Know one wants to 'talk' about it. Your called a 'wannabe' on one side and a 'mut' or worse on the other! It can bring great pain to a human heart, and great sorrow. It is like having your parents tell you your not good enough for them. Think how easy and wonderful it would be if everyone who came to this land had respected those that were here before them! If only......!!!! Then there would be no question as to my place in this chaotic world. I would know where and who I trully belonged and my spirit and my soul would fly to great heights! Great Creator hear my prayer.....
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Old 07-19-2010, 12:47 PM   #191
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wyo rose : Yes.. in fact, many of the whites initially, in the Martimes, partially assimiliated to the native way ... this blending of the French with the Lnu people was, by all accounts, beautiful and worked well.
The problem came when the British DID NOT mix and chose to view natives as enemies rather than as potential family.


In terms of a closed powwows : Yea...I never heard of a closed powwow either... which was my point. So long as there are no closed powwows, people of all types will show up.

In that case, you can get idiots of any color.... not just whites.

You figure... the "sacred stuff" is held...well, usually...in secret... and the rodeo, I mean, powwow is a social event open to everybody..

It is not a "white" thing..more over it is an "American thing" or a "Western thing".. because again... you could have people of ANY race showing up and being a moron..

Hell, I've been to dozens of powwows where many native people were acting like unashamed idiots...

It just so happens that there are like... 500,000,000 million white people out there... and if 1 in every 20 people is an idiot... well.... that means there are about 25,000,000 million idiots out there...

The odds that a few of the 25 million idiots among the whites (which is only 5% of their popultation) might show up at a big rodeo---urgh, I mean powwow--- is pretty high.
Those "whites" are lost culturally, can't even trace their roots to any one european culture.

St. Patrick's Day is a sham, a day to get drunk on green beer and pee blue. I would like to see it cancelled, it is an embarrassment for me.

On the powwow spectators problem, I have discussed with friends about being a "cultural advisor" actually wearing a vest so non-Natives could approach if they had questions, etc.

Not that I am an expert, but I find myself talking to people DAILY that have so many misconceptions. Here in southern California people don't understand that Bird Singing is the local tradition, the powwow singing and dancing is not done by the local tribes.

Also, the perception that ALL Indians get casino money and are rich, that one takes a bit of my time to break down for people. I get into some great discussions with all types of spectators, and I get some learning also when I meet big name cultural anthropologists, even missionaries that have lived close to the people.

It might seem strange idea, but one person walking around, or a booth near the entrance to introduce spectators to the culture might put the public in the proper frame of mind.

It's not Buffalo Bill's travelling western show....

peace-out
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Old 09-09-2010, 06:33 PM   #192
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Originally Posted by AmigoKumeyaay View Post
Those "whites" are lost culturally, can't even trace their roots to any one european culture.

St. Patrick's Day is a sham, a day to get drunk on green beer and pee blue. I would like to see it cancelled, it is an embarrassment for me.

On the powwow spectators problem, I have discussed with friends about being a "cultural advisor" actually wearing a vest so non-Natives could approach if they had questions, etc.

Not that I am an expert, but I find myself talking to people DAILY that have so many misconceptions. Here in southern California people don't understand that Bird Singing is the local tradition, the powwow singing and dancing is not done by the local tribes.

Also, the perception that ALL Indians get casino money and are rich, that one takes a bit of my time to break down for people. I get into some great discussions with all types of spectators, and I get some learning also when I meet big name cultural anthropologists, even missionaries that have lived close to the people.

It might seem strange idea, but one person walking around, or a booth near the entrance to introduce spectators to the culture might put the public in the proper frame of mind.

It's not Buffalo Bill's travelling western show....

peace-out
Amigo! That is a great idea! I vend at a lot of powwows. Sometimes I get asked questions I can answer, other times ones I can't. It would be great to direct people to someone that is easy to find! Your idea is in the words of the crazy chef Guy "Money"
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Old 09-09-2010, 07:08 PM   #193
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I personally dont have a problem with white people attending pow wows. As long as they are respectful of the grounds well that goes for everyone. Well if ya look at from my point of view some people rag on the white peope cuz they alwasy ask silly questions and even sometimes pay to take a picture with you. Thats kinda cool to me, cuz they are interested in the native cultures. But on the other hand the non-natives who WANT TO BE native is really pathedic. Afterall pow wows they are open to everyone...plus during intertribals usually the MC invites everyone to come out.
i loooove ur response best 1 ive read on this topic yet, every1 is human n some ppl have cried the same tears bout the past no matter wether their purple, i love native culture and hope to be excepted bc I do respect the grounds and will be 2mar.

may the creator bless u all
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Old 09-09-2010, 07:10 PM   #194
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Those "whites" are lost culturally, can't even trace their roots to any one european culture.

St. Patrick's Day is a sham, a day to get drunk on green beer and pee blue. I would like to see it cancelled, it is an embarrassment for me.

On the powwow spectators problem, I have discussed with friends about being a "cultural advisor" actually wearing a vest so non-Natives could approach if they had questions, etc.

Not that I am an expert, but I find myself talking to people DAILY that have so many misconceptions. Here in southern California people don't understand that Bird Singing is the local tradition, the powwow singing and dancing is not done by the local tribes.

Also, the perception that ALL Indians get casino money and are rich, that one takes a bit of my time to break down for people. I get into some great discussions with all types of spectators, and I get some learning also when I meet big name cultural anthropologists, even missionaries that have lived close to the people.

It might seem strange idea, but one person walking around, or a booth near the entrance to introduce spectators to the culture might put the public in the proper frame of mind.

It's not Buffalo Bill's travelling western show....

peace-out
whites r lost culturally bc theres no culture with the whites cept theivin n just lies so whtes look for a p[lace a better place where they seem to fit!!!! well(some) theres babd n good ppl in all races
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Old 09-10-2010, 02:27 AM   #195
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There are Cultural Events for Every Culture (notice I didn't say "race")

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Old 09-10-2010, 02:46 AM   #196
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BODEBEA BAY View Post
Amigo! That is a great idea! I vend at a lot of powwows. Sometimes I get asked questions I can answer, other times ones I can't. It would be great to direct people to someone that is easy to find! Your idea is in the words of the crazy chef Guy "Money"
I would have to be highly visible...hmmm

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Old 09-10-2010, 09:02 AM   #197
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Old 09-12-2010, 04:10 PM   #198
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I've only been to 2 powwows, but it was definitely fun and I hope to be able to go to more in the future. A guy I met took me and once we got there he just kinda let me run loose because he was a dancer- I guess he figured he didn't need to chaperone me to make sure I didn't make a fool of myself xD I'm glad. It's not that hard to be respectful... all you gotta do is act like a grown-a$$ adult LOL

What does kinda suck though is the automatic impression that you're white if you have pale skin... how can you know they're not 1/8 Native or something? I have white skin and blue eyes but I'm Ojibwe... if I ever met someone who could/was willing to teach me I'd love to dance, but I'm actually pretty nervous about even trying- afraid I'll get labeled a wannabe off the bat just because I look "white."
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Old 09-12-2010, 04:22 PM   #199
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IlnuSoldier View Post
Yes..it is my turn to chime in

Most powwows are just rodeos, let us be honest about that... I mean.. ."Grand Entry" even...

However, the serious powwows are usually CLOSED off ---- so no "white people" there.

If you are at an open powwow (read : Rodeo), then you open yourself up for ANYONE to show up ... like a carnival.

When you mix a "sacred event" with a "commerical enterprise"... you are going to get this ackward situation where people who don't know about your "sacred ways" will show up and .... BY DEFINITION... will act in a profrane way.

What do you expect when your 'sacred circle' is surrounded by dozens and dozens of food and leather vendors ?

Every powwow that is not on rez and closed-- Will experience this situation.

However--- this is the time to educate the whites and to not get made at them..

Heck-- YOU INVITED THEM TO COME... so as the host, it is YOUR job to be patient and understanding.

If you dont' want to deal with them, then attend CLOSED powwows.

Don't ask them to come and spend their money and then get made at them for being who they are...

Again--- you invite them, it is your job to educate.

OMG... yep, I said it.
Agreed, 100%!
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Old 09-12-2010, 05:33 PM   #200
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many paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these partsmany paws is infamous around these parts
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what am I ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pow wow guest View Post
Because of some of the responses to my little disagreement with some people on this board, and Mato's idea to stick to the subject, I decided to start a new thread.
I would like to hear from others on their feelings about white people attending Pow Wows. I don't mean "wannabes" because I am not a "wannabe", I go to Pow Wows to relax and enjoy the celebration, to listen to the music and see the interaction amoung the people, I adhere to all the rules and regulations, and I have also helped out at Pow Wows as security, setting up and then taking down at the end. I have seen the "wannabes" at Pow Wows and it bugs me as well as some of you on this board, I think it is a real dishonour to the native culture.
Guest
I have just returned from my first pow wow, I flew all the way to Kansas to attend. Just what exactly is a 'wannabe' ?...I have read Bury my heart, the Cherokee nation and many, many other books on Native culture, I have cried many times and cringed every time the whites took land in 'treaties', the slaughter makes me ashamed whenever my sun tan goes away...The more I learn the more I believe in the 'old ways', I believe in the Great Spirit (Wakan Tanka) and Mother Earth, I have read all the old stories and wear a carved bone water spider and my jewelry made for me by Soaring Eagle, no cheap reproductions. I buy all my Native clothes from actual Natives and my moccasins are from the Cherokee tribe. I do not dance it is not my place, I respect all Native etiquette and am very respectfull, I just try to understand and follow what is going on. I am moving to Cherokee North Carolina so I am learning Tsalagi, my given name is Many paws as I do animal rescue, so what does this make me ?....I admire and respect your culture, I live and behave differently than I used to, you should see my Sitting Bull face if I am annoyed with people who do not understand !
Wa do, o gi na li,
Many paws.
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