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Old 02-16-2012, 05:37 PM   #301
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Did I actually see somebody lay something at that guy's feet?
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Old 02-16-2012, 07:56 PM   #302
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzizila View Post
Did I actually see somebody lay something at that guy's feet?
Yep, he was on the beat!

I was there, but busy filming, I think he was part of a group of european tourists.

LOL maybe one of those DER INDIANER from Germany. He got juice!
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Old 05-24-2012, 07:26 PM   #303
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Originally Posted by this1ndnchic View Post
Thats kinda cool to me, cuz they are interested in the native cultures. But on the other hand the non-natives who WANT TO BE native is really pathedic.
What if those white people are trying to escape their white culture, to "deculturate" as white? Fact is, modern white culture is very destructive to many people living in it. I know it is to me just on the physical lifestyle part of it. It is destructive on account of a way of living that is unsustainable over the long run, separates us from each other, devalues us, and destroys the earth. Maybe the issue is that that woman realizes this (unless she was talking about the bible), and she is lost and needs help moving to the place she needs to go to in her heart. That's what happens to people when they find themselves trapped and are trying to find their way out.

This is what I mean, but first, I need to say something:

I am unregistered, of Cherokee ancestry, as my screen name indicates. My grandmother was Cherokee, but passed on when I was barely a year old, so I did not get to know her. I grew up in a household where apparently, my parents knew not to push the religion issue on me. Mom had me baptized shortly after I was born, but Dad refused to go along with it. After they divorced, I lived with Dad and stepmother (who tried once to convert me to Christianity, and it didn't take because I wouldn't accept it and questioned it too much). My parents believed that I was born deaf, but other things indicate that I lost my hearing very early on. I'm someone who experienced relative linguistic isolation for a very long time because of my profound deafness in the first seven-plus years of my life (no one knew that I was deaf until the very end of the first grade, when I had flunked out and was put in a school for children with disabilities early in the year, and it was after a school year of deaf education that I was exposed to religion for the first time, by a polish catholic nanny of all people. I could not believe what the grown woman was saying to me!), and also experienced a lack of verbal exposure to today's religions up until that time. I was very much wild and free (this is true, still even though I've had to temper the wild streak enough to survive, but I will NEVER lose it because it is too big inside me), and I was an easily frustrated children because I couldn't communicate very well with a very small vocabulary. My Old Way is Native Human living in modern civilization, and I have carried intact to this day this worldview, which I'm unable to explain because there are no words for it, as I didn't learn to talk English beyond two words until I was fitted with hearing aids during the seventh summer (I was born in January).

Today, I wrote this:

-----------------------------------
I just read something that is very difficult for me to deal with at the moment. I'm sick at home with a cough, and I couldn't sleep very much last night. I couldn't fall asleep, and I had to sooth myself of fear of the night by remembering the connection to my worldview and stepping into the light that is seen far off on mountain ridges, to bring warmth and pain relief on myself.

I've been struggling in the weeks since to determine if my Native or feral ways of looking at things can be interfaced with traditional Cherokee beliefs. It's possible that I may never complete this process... This, I read on acculturation/assimilation of Native Americans (and please read the article to make sense of it):

http://external.oneonta.edu/cooper/a...uny-zhang.html

"However trivial it may seem, this short exchange between Mohegan and the singing settler corresponds to Cooper's earlier presentation of the mixed provenance of Mohegan's attire both in implication and technique. If Mohegan's attire is not European enough to justify his total acculturation to white culture, Mohegan's short and gloomy answer to the singing settler's question about the music is obvious enough to reveal his reluctance to sever all his innate ties to the Native American traditions. His reluctance is strongly proved by what happens moments before his death near the end of The Pioneers. Knowing that the time of his death is drawing near, Mohegan completely reverts to his Indian tradition, painting his face and body, decorating himself with Indian ornaments, rejecting European clothing, and losing his ability to make baskets. Most importantly, however, Mohegan's belief in Christianity is gone, but his love for the Indian faith is back. Ultimately, Mohegan dies as an Indian, ascending to his Indian paradise. For him, as he describes in his last words, "The path is clear, and the eyes of Mohegan grow young. I look -- but I see no white-skins; there are none to be seen but just and brave Indians" (421). On the surface, Cooper might want us to be sad and, even, shocked to discover that Mohegan has never been as wholly "civilized" as he seems. His ulterior aim, however, is to use the reversal of Mohegan's acculturation, or what might be called the "deculturation" of Mohegan, to warn his contemporaries that the transformation of Native Americans through acculturation will never succeed. As he declares through the mouth of Natty Bumppo, "It's hard to keep them from going back to their native ways" (421)."

I just about cried when I read this. It is a very emotional piece for me, because I am Native, or an Ancient. I am one without a recognized spiritual faith, because I cannot explain what it is or how it works. Every time I look into different things, like rock bands, making things, or doing things, I lose interest and revert back to simply being, as I was as a child. My stepmother tried to acculturate me as a Christian one summer. I say acculturate because I was forced to go to bible summer school. I was not given a choice, since I was a lot smaller than her and couldn't fight back, and Dad couldn't stop her from making me go if he was out in the field working. I HATED IT, because it represented control about everything I do, (wait a minute, that might explain why this country is increasingly eroding our personal rights, which the Cherokee Nation was based on), and my stepmother didn't know what to do with me because I was wild when she met me, so she probably thought I needed to have the "savage" taken out of me (even if it was a mixed-blood/white one).

It's possible that the struggle I have is that I will not successfully assimilate into anything, because of my Native status, even if I try to assimilate into traditional Cherokee beliefs. I'm finding myself doing that. I really have to work hard to maintain interest in all but the basic interests, like making things, playing my didgeridoo (I'm having a hard time maintaining interest in my drum set playing at this time), learning culture and language little by little. I find myself reverting, "deculturating," as Cooper put it, to these interests only, and I realize now that I can't stop it. Only I'm doing it now and not near death because it is so strong.

It seems like I continually look for new things to do because I find it hard to feel okay about reverting to simple living. It's hard because I don't have someone who shares the same cultural situation. I feel alone in that regard.
----------------------------------

It would be interesting to see if it would be possible to talk to that woman who was escorted out and see if it would be possible to deculturate her from the white world if she is willing, and apply that to people who are trying to get out before they destroy themselves. They're doing a good job of destroying themselves in Europe, DC, and NYC. It's just a matter of time...
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Old 05-25-2012, 02:26 PM   #304
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Originally Posted by Unregistered Cheroke View Post
What if those white people are trying to escape their white culture, to "deculturate" as white? Fact is, modern white culture is very destructive to many people living in it. I know it is to me just on the physical lifestyle part of it. It is destructive on account of a way of living that is unsustainable over the long run, separates us from each other, devalues us, and destroys the earth. Maybe the issue is that that woman realizes this (unless she was talking about the bible), and she is lost and needs help moving to the place she needs to go to in her heart. That's what happens to people when they find themselves trapped and are trying to find their way out.

This is what I mean, but first, I need to say something:

I am unregistered, of Cherokee ancestry, as my screen name indicates. My grandmother was Cherokee, but passed on when I was barely a year old, so I did not get to know her. I grew up in a household where apparently, my parents knew not to push the religion issue on me. Mom had me baptized shortly after I was born, but Dad refused to go along with it. After they divorced, I lived with Dad and stepmother (who tried once to convert me to Christianity, and it didn't take because I wouldn't accept it and questioned it too much). My parents believed that I was born deaf, but other things indicate that I lost my hearing very early on. I'm someone who experienced relative linguistic isolation for a very long time because of my profound deafness in the first seven-plus years of my life (no one knew that I was deaf until the very end of the first grade, when I had flunked out and was put in a school for children with disabilities early in the year, and it was after a school year of deaf education that I was exposed to religion for the first time, by a polish catholic nanny of all people. I could not believe what the grown woman was saying to me!), and also experienced a lack of verbal exposure to today's religions up until that time. I was very much wild and free (this is true, still even though I've had to temper the wild streak enough to survive, but I will NEVER lose it because it is too big inside me), and I was an easily frustrated children because I couldn't communicate very well with a very small vocabulary. My Old Way is Native Human living in modern civilization, and I have carried intact to this day this worldview, which I'm unable to explain because there are no words for it, as I didn't learn to talk English beyond two words until I was fitted with hearing aids during the seventh summer (I was born in January).

Today, I wrote this:

-----------------------------------
I just read something that is very difficult for me to deal with at the moment. I'm sick at home with a cough, and I couldn't sleep very much last night. I couldn't fall asleep, and I had to sooth myself of fear of the night by remembering the connection to my worldview and stepping into the light that is seen far off on mountain ridges, to bring warmth and pain relief on myself.

I've been struggling in the weeks since to determine if my Native or feral ways of looking at things can be interfaced with traditional Cherokee beliefs. It's possible that I may never complete this process... This, I read on acculturation/assimilation of Native Americans (and please read the article to make sense of it):

http://external.oneonta.edu/cooper/a...uny-zhang.html

"However trivial it may seem, this short exchange between Mohegan and the singing settler corresponds to Cooper's earlier presentation of the mixed provenance of Mohegan's attire both in implication and technique. If Mohegan's attire is not European enough to justify his total acculturation to white culture, Mohegan's short and gloomy answer to the singing settler's question about the music is obvious enough to reveal his reluctance to sever all his innate ties to the Native American traditions. His reluctance is strongly proved by what happens moments before his death near the end of The Pioneers. Knowing that the time of his death is drawing near, Mohegan completely reverts to his Indian tradition, painting his face and body, decorating himself with Indian ornaments, rejecting European clothing, and losing his ability to make baskets. Most importantly, however, Mohegan's belief in Christianity is gone, but his love for the Indian faith is back. Ultimately, Mohegan dies as an Indian, ascending to his Indian paradise. For him, as he describes in his last words, "The path is clear, and the eyes of Mohegan grow young. I look -- but I see no white-skins; there are none to be seen but just and brave Indians" (421). On the surface, Cooper might want us to be sad and, even, shocked to discover that Mohegan has never been as wholly "civilized" as he seems. His ulterior aim, however, is to use the reversal of Mohegan's acculturation, or what might be called the "deculturation" of Mohegan, to warn his contemporaries that the transformation of Native Americans through acculturation will never succeed. As he declares through the mouth of Natty Bumppo, "It's hard to keep them from going back to their native ways" (421)."

I just about cried when I read this. It is a very emotional piece for me, because I am Native, or an Ancient. I am one without a recognized spiritual faith, because I cannot explain what it is or how it works. Every time I look into different things, like rock bands, making things, or doing things, I lose interest and revert back to simply being, as I was as a child. My stepmother tried to acculturate me as a Christian one summer. I say acculturate because I was forced to go to bible summer school. I was not given a choice, since I was a lot smaller than her and couldn't fight back, and Dad couldn't stop her from making me go if he was out in the field working. I HATED IT, because it represented control about everything I do, (wait a minute, that might explain why this country is increasingly eroding our personal rights, which the Cherokee Nation was based on), and my stepmother didn't know what to do with me because I was wild when she met me, so she probably thought I needed to have the "savage" taken out of me (even if it was a mixed-blood/white one).

It's possible that the struggle I have is that I will not successfully assimilate into anything, because of my Native status, even if I try to assimilate into traditional Cherokee beliefs. I'm finding myself doing that. I really have to work hard to maintain interest in all but the basic interests, like making things, playing my didgeridoo (I'm having a hard time maintaining interest in my drum set playing at this time), learning culture and language little by little. I find myself reverting, "deculturating," as Cooper put it, to these interests only, and I realize now that I can't stop it. Only I'm doing it now and not near death because it is so strong.

It seems like I continually look for new things to do because I find it hard to feel okay about reverting to simple living. It's hard because I don't have someone who shares the same cultural situation. I feel alone in that regard.
----------------------------------

It would be interesting to see if it would be possible to talk to that woman who was escorted out and see if it would be possible to deculturate her from the white world if she is willing, and apply that to people who are trying to get out before they destroy themselves. They're doing a good job of destroying themselves in Europe, DC, and NYC. It's just a matter of time...
Naw just tourists see them all the time, they come visit and then back to "there" life...
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Old 05-25-2012, 03:09 PM   #305
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Originally Posted by Josiah View Post
Naw just tourists see them all the time, they come visit and then back to "there" life...
If they're just asking you to teach them as you said, that can be a problem... I feel they ought to just observe and let it go afterwards.
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Old 05-25-2012, 03:24 PM   #306
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I've seen a LOT of white folk at powwows, I've also seen a lot of blacks and Hispanics too, and most of the time folks are respectful. Many, probably because their folks told stories that their folks told them about the old days or what they saw in a traveling old west show, or whatever, so the are enamored with natives and their ways and cultures. Most observe and move on, but then there are some who cross the line to rude and disrespectful and claim they have a right to know. These, though are very few in occurrence, for the most part, are the ones that stick out in our minds, and yet, we tend to give all white folks a bad name. Kinda like all indians are drunks who are lazy and don't want to take care of their kids. Interresting!
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Old 06-10-2012, 06:52 PM   #307
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Turtle Island Religion?

I'm not really a forum person, but was lonely in my white native religion. So my question is how many here are white and native and have built their own religious beliefs around their personal experiences?
I have been a "Practicing Native American" for many years and am well travelled in the U.S. It seems I am the only one. I've met Muslims, Hindus, Christians and the like but never another one like myself.
Please tell me there are more like me.

My current beliefs are few. Basically a personal relationship with God (name unknown). I also feel everything and everyone is connected in some spiritual manner and is influenced by contact. Aside from that I pray frequently and have chosen a turtle necklace to wear as a reminder to do so. I chose this symbol for it's representation of the name of the continent I live on and I like turtles ;)
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Old 06-11-2012, 10:13 AM   #308
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I'm not really a forum person, but was lonely in my white native religion. So my question is how many here are white and native and have built their own religious beliefs around their personal experiences?
I have been a "Practicing Native American" for many years and am well travelled in the U.S. It seems I am the only one. I've met Muslims, Hindus, Christians and the like but never another one like myself.
Please tell me there are more like me.

My current beliefs are few. Basically a personal relationship with God (name unknown). I also feel everything and everyone is connected in some spiritual manner and is influenced by contact. Aside from that I pray frequently and have chosen a turtle necklace to wear as a reminder to do so. I chose this symbol for it's representation of the name of the continent I live on and I like turtles ;)


Help yourself folks
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Old 06-11-2012, 01:54 PM   #309
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I have a personal relationship with chocolate.
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Old 06-11-2012, 03:24 PM   #310
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I have a personal relationship with chocolate.
mil, sweet, dark or white? Hey! white chocolate, white people at powows hmmmm, coincidence? I think not!
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Old 06-13-2012, 03:20 PM   #311
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Its All Grooooovy Baby!


.
Any chocolate you can get is Groooooovy Baby!
.
.
Even Shag-a-licious! OOooooohhhhh!

Last edited by AmigoKumeyaay; 06-13-2012 at 03:26 PM..
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Old 06-13-2012, 04:20 PM   #312
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.
Any chocolate you can get is Groooooovy Baby!
.
.
Even Shag-a-licious! OOooooohhhhh!
Hm? What? Sorry, was starring at the milk duds.
Mmmmmmmmmm Chocolate!
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Old 06-13-2012, 11:12 PM   #313
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I have a personal relationship with chocolate.
I have a personal relationship with scotch.
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Old 06-14-2012, 07:39 PM   #314
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neling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond reputeneling4 has a reputation beyond repute
I have a close personal relationship with coffee.
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Old 06-15-2012, 06:57 PM   #315
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Old 07-08-2012, 07:15 AM   #316
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Christelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond reputeChristelle has a reputation beyond repute
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Hi !
I do not have personal relationship with anything but I try to have relationship with everybody LOL
and I would like to share with you all if you agree. I excpect nothing from you except what you are able to give. I offer my friendship if you want it.
I have nerver gone to a Pow Wow (except Ornans France) and if I do so, one day, it would be only to look and to listen, not to participate and disturb because I am not native and I think it is not my right.
I think I am open minded and undestand quite well each point of view but I am also very sensitive and when I read certain posts, wonder if I am in a wrong way.
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Old 08-14-2018, 02:02 AM   #317
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Smile Old...white...and Cherokee

When people look at me...they see white. My grandfather used to take us to pow wows when we were 5-9 years old. I learned to dance among our friends and cousins. My great grandfather and grandfather look Native American. Sadly my grandfather passed away when I was younger and we lost touch with all of our Cherokee family. Now that I am the grandfather of my family and the oldest person in our family as well.....I want to take my grandson. But as I stated earlier...my skin is white. I was rasised to never judge a book by itís cover or a man by the size of his wallet. What is in my heart has always been there and always will. Next spring...2018, I plan to attend the first pow wow Iíve been to in 47 years. I want to dance one more time....and show my grandson his heritage, begin to teach him about the real world.
Should I therefore anticipate hatred and rejection because my skin is lighter? When I was a child, it was a magical time. The food, laughter, friendship has been some of my fondest memories. I hope that some of the younger dancers will read this and know that a lighter pigmentation cannot change your heart. I hope that our children will judge men and women by their actions.....not their words or color.
Probably said way more than I should have but I hope to see some friendly faces in Cherokee NC next year. Gives me a whole year to practice...lol.
Best of wishes to all.....Mike. Grandpa used to call me rabbit boy. Oh...my first post here too!
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Old 08-14-2018, 10:26 AM   #318
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welcome to powwows.calm ! I would think they would welcome you and your family at any powwow ! Now days folks are fairly accepting......why ? Because the full bloods are fewer and the mixed are everywhere. Just my opinion ! I used to dance. Now I'm just too old and fat ! LOL
__________________
I believe blood quantums are the governments way to breed us out of existance !


They say blood is thicker than water ! Now maple syrup is thicker than blood , so are pancakes more important than family ?

There are "Elders" and there are "Olders". Being the second one doesn't make the first one true !

Somebody is out there somewhere, thinking of you and the impact you made in their life.
It's not me....I think you're an idiot !





There's a chance you might not like me ,

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Old 10-06-2018, 08:11 PM   #319
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Dance, pray, dance, pray I look ScotsIrish there is some Native in there. Jesus,my savior keeps me spiritual. That and talking to trees.
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Old 10-06-2018, 09:06 PM   #320
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ches View Post
Dance, pray, dance, pray I look ScotsIrish there is some Native in there. Jesus,my savior keeps me spiritual. That and talking to trees.
So who is Jesus ? Mexican gardener ??? What did he save you from ? Do the trees ever answer ?
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__________________
I believe blood quantums are the governments way to breed us out of existance !


They say blood is thicker than water ! Now maple syrup is thicker than blood , so are pancakes more important than family ?

There are "Elders" and there are "Olders". Being the second one doesn't make the first one true !

Somebody is out there somewhere, thinking of you and the impact you made in their life.
It's not me....I think you're an idiot !





There's a chance you might not like me ,

but there's a bigger

chance I won't care
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