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Old 10-08-2006, 11:44 PM   #1
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Rattles?

Are gourd dancing rattles always made of gourds or cans? Has anyone ever seen a deer toe rattle used? Also, is it permissable for a woman to make one to honor a relative who is a veteran?
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Old 10-10-2006, 04:09 PM   #2
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I have seen Cans mostly
Church Members use Gourds but this is not a Hard and Fast rule



I was taught to make own Rattles for Gourd Dancing
Other things can be made for you
Sash
Blanket
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Old 10-11-2006, 05:39 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winterwhite
Are gourd dancing rattles always made of gourds or cans? Has anyone ever seen a deer toe rattle used? Also, is it permissable for a woman to make one to honor a relative who is a veteran?

i make a gourd type rattle that uses a soda can. so far ive gotten pretty mixed reaction to it, some people love it others think its on the verge of blasphme.
the intent was to make a socio-political statement about the backdoor assimilationist policies and the effects they're having on ndn lifeways and health standards. the first batch of 10 that i made were done with coke cans. i used 100% recycled materials. the coke cans came from my own emptied cans, the handles were from an old spindle back rocking chair i garbage picked (thinking i could fix) and the rattling matterial was unpopped popcorn kernls and other wood came from pallets in my basement.
i wanted to show how modern dominant culture had spread to evelope every corner of even the most traditional lifeways. i dont think there is a single place in america where people dont recognize the cokacola logo and iconry.
in addition to things like coke entering the lifeways they bring with them things like diabetes and the inability to pay the rising health care costs and the further reliance government sponsors.

like i said before, some people like them, some people dont, others would like to see me dragged out and shot for having made them.
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Old 10-11-2006, 10:55 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FluteMaker
i make a gourd type rattle that uses a soda can. so far ive gotten pretty mixed reaction to it, some people love it others think its on the verge of blasphme.
the intent was to make a socio-political statement about the backdoor assimilationist policies and the effects they're having on ndn lifeways and health standards. the first batch of 10 that i made were done with coke cans. i used 100% recycled materials. the coke cans came from my own emptied cans, the handles were from an old spindle back rocking chair i garbage picked (thinking i could fix) and the rattling matterial was unpopped popcorn kernls and other wood came from pallets in my basement.
i wanted to show how modern dominant culture had spread to evelope every corner of even the most traditional lifeways. i dont think there is a single place in america where people dont recognize the cokacola logo and iconry.
in addition to things like coke entering the lifeways they bring with them things like diabetes and the inability to pay the rising health care costs and the further reliance government sponsors.

like i said before, some people like them, some people dont, others would like to see me dragged out and shot for having made them.
I Just Dance, I think of nothing else
I enjoy the songs and let them wash over me
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Old 10-24-2006, 07:06 PM   #5
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anyone know where i can find a good quality rattle at a decent price so i can pratice songs for church meetings?
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Old 10-24-2006, 07:47 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blacktail
anyone know where i can find a good quality rattle at a decent price so i can pratice songs for church meetings?

http://www.wanderingbull.com/

they have a decent looking horn rattle for about $20 they re listed under music and instruments. also have cowrie rattles and rawhide rattles

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Old 10-25-2006, 10:21 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blacktail
anyone know where i can find a good quality rattle at a decent price so i can pratice songs for church meetings?
ummm believe it or not but crazy crow sells a decent plain rattle just need to bead the handle

http://www.crazycrow.com/Merchant2/m...de=710-000-000
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Old 10-25-2006, 11:07 AM   #8
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Used to use a can type, was giving a gourd this past summer.
Doesn't really matter which you use.
It's all about the song and dance.
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Old 10-25-2006, 06:20 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FluteMaker
http://www.wanderingbull.com/

they have a decent looking horn rattle for about $20 they re listed under music and instruments. also have cowrie rattles and rawhide rattles
oh no i meant gourd rattle. we use gourd rattles during n.a.c. meetings. sorry if i didn't make that clear.
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Old 10-25-2006, 06:31 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josiah
ummm believe it or not but crazy crow sells a decent plain rattle just need to bead the handle

http://www.crazycrow.com/Merchant2/m...de=710-000-000
they don't have ready made ones do they? don't remember seeing any. not that it'd be that big of a deal to buy the parts and put it together myself. what do you put in them to get the best sound, bb's?
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Old 10-26-2006, 08:42 AM   #11
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ok, if you need a specific gourd rattle then go look up the one at crazy crow. it is a kit type thing. you get the can the handle and the horse hair for the tip, some assembally required.
the coka-cola rattles i made i used unpopped popcorn kernles and got a nice sound. you could also try dried beans. im not sure about the metal on metal sound youd get from BBs
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Old 10-26-2006, 12:14 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blacktail
they don't have ready made ones do they? don't remember seeing any. not that it'd be that big of a deal to buy the parts and put it together myself. what do you put in them to get the best sound, bb's?
You can use popcorn
Ummm
My Cheyenne Father uses rocks gathered from ant hills for his NAC gourd
I forgot the name of the pebbles they are typically red
in his other rattles he uses just about anything
I have even heard of rice
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Old 10-26-2006, 06:18 PM   #13
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great! thanks guys.
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Old 10-26-2006, 06:48 PM   #14
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yes you are from michigan use deer toes that all i have to say
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Old 10-29-2006, 03:28 PM   #15
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As far as gourd rattles go I have seen many iteams used. Even seen deer toes used. At one time people were using those egg shaped tea bag strainners. As far as what is used in side of the shaker, many things are used. But you have to find a sound that works for you. I like the shot used for shot gun shells. But one thing I advise look at what the Kiowas and Comanches, and people like that who do this all the time and see what they use and maybe use it your self. And do not make things up that you think might be cool to use, because you like it.

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Old 10-30-2006, 02:19 AM   #16
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ww

I have never seen someone...or at let me rephrase that...someone that knows what they are doing use a deer toe rattle for gourd dance...not saying you can't just that I have never seen anyone worth lookin at use one. I have seen many people use actual gourds rather than cans, but I was taught to only use cans for gourd dance out of respect for the NAC folks out in and around the arena. As for the filler in the can, I use cut up wire or nails because they are not round and will not start spinning inside the can (which can happen when you start getting into it.

blacktail

You looking for a really nice rattle you can later take into meetin or just any ole thing to just practice with? You want it beaded or not? Guess the question is how fancy you want it.

Now as for making one yourself and making sure it has a good sound, trick is to keep the gourd from contacting the plug in the bottom. You just want this plug to set inside the neck without actually touching the gourd itself, all it has to do is keep the filler from falling out. This allows the gourd to resonate more than if the gourd is in solid contact with the plug in the neck of the gourd. (It is kinda like a bell, if you hold the bell by the handle ...good sound ... if you hold it by both the top and bottom...it's flat soundin.) To do this you have to make sure the hole in the top is just big enough to allow the gourd to slide down only so far and the easiest way to achieve this is to make sure the handle post going up through the gourd is tapered nicely. You then make the plug by drilling it and shaping it to fit up and in the gourd without touching. If it does touch sand it down some more. The inside of the gourd can also be sanded down but I save that for the final fitting, but be sure not to go crazy on it. Now drill a small hole in the top of the gourd and slowly start opening up the hole a bit at a time until it slides down the post to the point you want without going to far. I like to use a reamer for this part of the sizing. Finally make your stopper for the top of the handle post and put it all together. Not sure I know 2 folks that like to use the same thing inside their gourds...so experiment a bit on that one.. This is why good sounding rattles ain't always cheap, a microscopic amount of over-shaping and you have to start all over again...LOL
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Old 10-30-2006, 03:43 AM   #17
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like one of the guys said in his post use rocks from the ant bed there is meaning to every part of the (tiah piah ) gourd dance they use the real gourds in the tipi now and the metal ones in the arena but see older guys useing there gourds just try to follow the same road the elders showed us in honor of that red wolf.
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Old 11-02-2006, 03:15 AM   #18
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Those little rocks are Garnets. I have a Gourd with the little Garnets, this was given to me.
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Old 11-02-2006, 11:33 AM   #19
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Those little rocks are Garnets. I have a Gourd with the little Garnets, this was given to me.
Ahhh
For the life of me I could not remember the name of them
I just wrote little rocks from ant hills
They make a very good sound
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Old 11-02-2006, 02:37 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Josiah
Ahhh
For the life of me I could not remember the name of them
I just wrote little rocks from ant hills
They make a very good sound


are we talking the same garnets like the gem stones? isnt the birth stone for janurary garnet?
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