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Old 05-01-2002, 10:32 AM   #1
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Where did this come from?

What is the origin of the Gourd dance?
What's it all about?
What are there any stories/legends associated with it?
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Old 05-01-2002, 10:36 AM   #2
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I've seen the dance, read a great deal of opinions and commentary about it, but don't know where it came from.
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Old 05-01-2002, 11:37 AM   #3
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ok sorry but i cant figure out how to get the website name so you can click from here.. so just type in www.gourddancing.homestead.com he has done some exstensive work with this website when your done sign his guest book and let him know what you think :)

Last edited by Paul G; 05-01-2002 at 12:40 PM..
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Old 05-01-2002, 11:38 AM   #4
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never mind our webbie does it for ya.. cool thanks just dlick and go :)
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Old 05-01-2002, 12:07 PM   #5
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I couldn't get it. Says website cannot be found. :(
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Old 05-01-2002, 12:14 PM   #6
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thanks for the info, mato did you try just typing it in? it is in my favorites so i just click and go... try putting gouddancing in search and see what you come up with there, i will try to fix this if i can
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Old 05-01-2002, 12:30 PM   #7
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Have you tried the Kiowa Nation homepage?
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Old 05-01-2002, 12:31 PM   #8
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My two cents worth....find a Kiowa, it was their dance and has been passed to other tribes.......
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Old 05-01-2002, 01:17 PM   #9
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I was told that the gourd dance was originated by the Comanches. They would jump off of their horses in battle and sing. They would kind of hop forward a little and then go back. Each time progressing. They would do this as a group of 200 or more men before actually going into battle. It was a ceromony. My father in law did a study at the Smithsonian in the '50's and then with the assistance of the elder Comanches, they revived the "Comanche Little Pony Society". Of course, I have heard the Kiowas RedWolf story too, how the Red Wolf was singing the songs to that dance. But regardless of which origin you follow , it is a dance that belongs to the Southwest Oklahoma tribes, mainly Kiowas and Comanches. My dad is a member of the Kiowa Tia-Piah Society, and of course, my husband and children belong to the Comanche Little Ponies. I have a great respect for the Comanches, if not only for the fact that they have kept their history amongst themselves. I have personally spoken with Woogie and Eva Watchetaker, Chief Padapony, and various other elders and questioned them as to the origins of their ceremonies. They take pride in not having too much of it written down, due to the fact that other tribes "sold out" their heritage and basically made up stories to get well known. They are very strict in their dress, songs, dances, and ceremonies. They know the truth about their history as well as the other tribes that live around them. This history has been rooted and grounded into my children by these same people mentioned who have passed on as well as my father in law and husband.
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Old 05-01-2002, 01:34 PM   #10
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i believe the cheyennes also claim this dance im not for curtain though
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Old 05-01-2002, 04:32 PM   #11
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origins

I don't follow either Kiowa or Comanche but have friends that are.
Following Ponca I was told Kiowa origins. If you look at Doc Tate's painting you will see a lot of gourd influence there. Also NAC. I know he was big into Little Ponies so you have several influences there. He would get a kick out of the fact that shortly I will get out of FL for good. It was a running joke.
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Old 05-01-2002, 08:08 PM   #12
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I'm in Georgia...don't know anyone here to ask.

Thanks for the info y'all...and if anyone knows any Kiowa people here in GA, send them my way...if they wanna share information over a nice home cooked meal.
:)
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Old 05-01-2002, 09:06 PM   #13
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gourd dance

Try the archives I know this was a topic before.
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Old 05-01-2002, 11:39 PM   #14
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Quote:
I was told that the gourd dance was originated by the Comanches. They would jump off of their horses in battle and sing. They would kind of hop forward a little and then go back. Each time progressing. They would do this as a group of 200 or more men before actually going into battle. It was a ceromony
Quote:
, I have heard the Kiowas RedWolf story too, how the Red Wolf was singing the songs to that dance. But regardless of which origin you follow , it is a dance that belongs to the Southwest Oklahoma tribes, mainly Kiowas and Comanches.
STATE--I forgot your dad told me the Commanche origins. Like you said "regardless of which origin you follow, it is a dance that belongs to the Southwest Oklahoma tribes, mainly Kiowa and Comanches."

Heard both stories - several times at family gatherings. Have no preference just know that our family enjoys participating in all aspects. Just wanted to let you know that I forgot what your dad said - just remembered what we hear most of the time. Maybe we could find an emcee that knows both histories.:)

I hope you are well and again congrats on GON.
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Old 05-02-2002, 03:32 AM   #15
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Louis Garcia said something a while back in one of his post. If you look many tribes had dances that resemble one another. I have heard storys from various tribes that had something that was like the gourd dance.

I believe with alot of tribes having the sundance, a lot of groups had something along thease lines. And a lot of credit goes to the Kiowas and Commanches for keeping the songs alive. Cause with out the songs all you have is stories.
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Old 05-09-2002, 08:38 AM   #16
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Dear Folks..........The most definitive work done on gourd dance is in a book called "Kiowa Voices" printed by TCU press volume 1. To understand this dance it is important to go to the people that orginated it that being the Kiowa. It was historically one of the war societies of the Kiowa tribe called the Ti Paye. A number of tribes claim to have a story of starting the Gourd Dance how ever after careful research you find that they all lead back to the Kiowa tribe.
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Old 05-09-2002, 04:36 PM   #17
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nabeader,
If you think "Kiowa Voices" is definitive check out Eric Lassiters, " The Power of Kiowa Song
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Old 05-09-2002, 05:02 PM   #18
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Too funny! I just got the Kiowa Voices Vol 1 and 2 from amazon not long ago! Just getting into it.
I found a girl in the legends book who looks JUST like my daughter!

Take a look.
The picture of my daughter was taken last year, she looks more like the Kiowa girl now, but she likes to giggle when I take her picture.

http://www.ofoto.com/I.jsp?m=25488721403&n=643557539

Thank you for the great information.
If you would like to share any of your experiences with the gourd dance, please share them.
If not for yourself, who do YOU dance for?
I can't tell you of any generation in my family who hasn't served in the military. My brother is a vet as well and I think he may be very interested in your stories....perhaps honoring our family members in the circle as well.
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Last edited by MuzeBl; 05-09-2002 at 05:05 PM..
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Old 05-10-2002, 04:32 AM   #19
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Being a woman, we here in California are not at all allowed to dance in the arena during the Gourd Dance. I dance off to the side to support my brothers from the Vietnam War who are dancing and most importantly to honor my father, a veteran of WW2, the beaches of Normandy. I reflect that the suffering I might be going through is tiny compared to what he went through and it gives me strength.
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Old 05-10-2002, 12:58 PM   #20
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Originally posted by raptor
nabeader,
If you think "Kiowa Voices" is definitive check out Eric Lassiters, " The Power of Kiowa Song
I respectfully disagree. There is no definitive work on the Kiowa Gourd Dance. More importantly, I don't think that Eric sees his book in that light either. Kiowa Voices is one of the few works with the blessing of the Kiowa elders.

I think Eric's book had a different purpose. He does a great job of going through some of those songs. His interviews are insightful. He generally relied on and worked with wonderful, genuine people who didn't mind sharing their thoughts. Really, it goes beyond just gourd dance. But definitive? I don't think so.

Here's another question: should there be a definitive work?
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