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Beardancer 09-06-2000 06:10 PM

Rossettes
 
Hey there beaders,
I've been beading for a while and now comes the time to bead rossettes/medallions. Now the question is HOW?? I need all the tips and tricks anybody can throw! Thanks
Beardncr

Lone Fox 09-07-2000 05:12 PM

Beardancer :

Rosettes can be done with one needle or two needles. Which would you prefer ?

By the way did you get my private e-mail to you about the deer toes that you asked about on the general crafts board ?

Lone Fox

Lone Fox 09-11-2000 10:44 PM

Beardancer:

Use an embroidery hoop to stretch your cloth, or buckskin out. Draw an outline of your pattern on it in pencil. These will be your guidelines.

1.) Using The One Needle Process:

Start at the center by sewing one bead at the center. Depending on the size of beads. Either Three or Four will fit, for your first half of first row around. This should fit just short of 180 degrees around the first bead that you sewed down. When you get the count of this. Then sew it down by passing the needle and thread through the material.
Go back two beads and come back up and through these beads again with thread. Now string the other half of first row. The other 180 degrees around the center bead. Pass needle and thread through the material, then back and up through the last two beads again.
Then down into the material again. The First complete circle row should be in place now. Move out to the next row by moving thread out a little bit on the backside of the material then coming up and through the material. Put four beads on the thread. Go down into the material, back up through the last two beads and just continue to do this until the rosette is complete. Picking up four beads at a time and sewing them down by coming back and up through the last two.

2.) Using The Two Needle Process:

Start the same way by sewing down a center bead.
Now one needle and thread is going to be used to thread the beads. While the other needle and thread are going to be used the stitch it down to the material.
Put as many beads on the needle and thread as required to go completely around the first bead. With the other needle and thread, every other bead will be stitched down to the material by coming up through the material and over the bead thread and back down through the material.
Do not pull this stitching thread too tight or you will get little bumps and ridges every other bead. Similar to a Lazy Stitch look. When you move out a row you could do the stitch thread every Third bead or even Fourth bead. I would not go any further then that or you will get the Lazy Stitch lumps again. By trying to put too many beads on between the stitching threads.

Those are the basics to Rosette making. They are also the same types of stitching for doing any Applique type Beadwork. Just following a pattern on material, not in a circle. But with applique beading you start by doing your outlines then infilling the beaded areas. That way you can pack the beads tighter into the center by fitting just one more row of beads into the area. Making for a tight fit on that last row of beads.

I prefer the one needle method myself. Seems to give me a more uniform type of appearance. But I have seen both done with beautiful results on Rosettes.

Does that answer your question.

Lone Fox

[This message has been edited by Lone Fox (edited September 11, 2000).]

feathr3166 09-14-2000 03:57 PM

Ayi Aya!! I love making rosettes and find them very relaxing when i'm stressed from work. the directions given above are excellent (well done!) and as it was also stated, i find the one needle process much easier to contend with. My grandmother did mention to me once that using only 4 beads at a time makes the lines stay better and after trying both ways... i find that putting no more then 6 on the needle at one time works well... more then that? i get bubbles in my work and then i'm not happy with it.

just a suggestion...

that is all i have to say

Benther_Dunthat 09-14-2000 06:43 PM

In addition to the instructions others posted I was also taught to use a light coating of paste or glue and glue some brown paper like you get your groceries in to the cloth. This helps keep the cloth from stretching and showing buckles as you work on it. If I recall correctly the paper ended up on the inside between beads and cloth but I suppose it could be done either way. Do it on the outside and it would come off eventually.

Benther

Lone Fox 09-14-2000 10:21 PM

Benther :

Wouldn't the paper backing hold moisture ?

That could be a problem in the long run. I
do my Rosette beading on a tan colored canvas material. Then depending on what it is to be used for. I'll glue a leather backing onto it. For a center piece Rosette. Or sew it directly onto the material that it belongs too. Trailer, Buckskin Dress, etc.

Just curious about the paper thingy.

Lone Fox

Suzizila 09-14-2000 10:43 PM

Here are some things that help me out when I make rosettes.

(1) I do my beading on an index card. If you do this, you need to be really careful and take your time. When finished with your beading, glue another index card on to the back of your beadwork to reinforce it. Then you can back it with leather.

(2) There is a book by Sadie Starr( I don't remember the title off hand)that has all sorts of graphs for beading. Toward the end of the book, there is a graph for making rosettes. It is really large, but you can make a copy of the page and cut it down to size for your project. I usually draw my design on the graph paper, cut it to fit my index card, and glue it on with a glue stick(a little less messy, but still very effective).

I hope this helps.

R-Lee 09-14-2000 10:50 PM

The index card does make a good flat and even rosette. However, I started using poster board. I glue one sheet of canvas on the backside with Tacky Glue. That way, the threads can never pull out of the cardboard. When you are done, glue the leather on the back with contact cement (don't forget the ties) and edge bead all the way around.

DCP 09-14-2000 11:35 PM

I have found that stretching fabric on a hoop can cause the beadwork to "lump" once you take it off the hoop.

I've been doing rosettes and some other beadwork on the fabric upholsterers use to stiffen the skirts on furniture. It is firm, doesn't rip, and doesn't fray. No multi-layering needed (so the posterboard/index card isn't necessary in addition to cloth).

I believe that the single most important factor in good rosettes is sorting the beads. For the pattern to look just right, it takes careful bead-size selection. I have found that when beads are labelled a particular size, that is only the average size of what's on the hank! Size 11o's will have 12o's and 10os in there, too (as well as the funky mutant shaped beads).

Lone Fox 09-15-2000 01:29 AM

Dan :
The key to using a hoop for Rosettes is not to stretch the material. I use the hoop only to hold the material flat. Not to stretch it.
Most of the time I do the same thing to hold my Lazy Stitch work as well. Makes it easy to handle and flip over and such. See what the stitching is doing on the backside.

You are right, about the material stretch though. The tension is the key, not to get the lumpy effect. It does take practice.

I'm interested in this upholsters fabric that you got. Can you bring some along to the Dells next month. That will be the next time, I will see you. To bad we did not have this conversation last week. I could have looked at it last weekend, when I saw you. I was the one fixing my broken bustle trailer dowel just before grand entry.

Lone Fox


[This message has been edited by Lone Fox (edited September 15, 2000).]

lil-leprachaunstrtdancer 09-15-2000 10:59 AM

a couple years ago I bought a pair of rosettes up in Anadarko, OK that an old Kiowa woman made, and the backing she used was a piece of posterboard with felt glued to the back, and beaded straight onto the posterboard...I guess that way, you can draw out your patterns on the posterboard and just go from there...

raptor 09-15-2000 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BeadedPony:
Before someone jumps in and tells me I've missed a type of rosette, I'll say there are actually 3 -- .
I think at least four...the three you maned and then flat gourdstitch and who can name any others?


BeadedPony 09-15-2000 05:12 PM

Doggone it, Raptor...I knew someone would remember another!! http://www.powwows.com/ubb/smile.gif

Some of the most beautiful work are those flat gourd Comanche rosettes!!!

Thanks for reminding me.

Lone Fox 09-15-2000 08:29 PM

Raptor - that reminds me of a time when a person asked me about Peyote beading on a stick. He wanted to bead over the end of the stick. To close it off. It took me about a half hour to flat stitch a rossette to fit the end of his dance stick and get him started on the linear part of his pattern.

I forgot about that as a method of Rosette making.

I have also seen some Old Time Sioux style Rosettes that do a spock type of design. Using more of a Lazy Stitch type of look. Working outwards like spocks on a wheel. The first section is one bead row wide. With 6 or 8 beads to the row in this section of area. The next section is two bead rows wide. With 6 to 8 beads to the row in that section. You keep adding an extra row to each section, as you work your way towards the outside of the piece.

With this though the backing material shows through as the spocks seperate on the outer part of the certain section. Reminds me of a ferris wheel type of a look.

I think this was used more as a Medallion then a Rosette, I guess. I have never tried this though.

Just another way things were done, I guess.

Lone Fox

BeadedPony 09-16-2000 01:04 AM

Okay, here's my .02 worth on the topic. There are two styles of rosettes -- the circular patterned ones where you begin in the middle and work around and around toward the outer edge. These are best worked on a piece of light-weight cardboard -- I use file folder covers (the older folks used to like to use cigarette cartons) -- but I also have a layer of light canvas/muslin/etc. underneath to hold it all together. Once the rosette is finished, it's then backed with buckskin and edge beaded.

The other kind of rosette is the appliqued (yes, I know the rounds ones are appliqued too) with the beads going in various directions of the pattern. I still use the cardboard and fabric backing, but these I put on a hoop because the various directions of the bead placement doesn't keep the tension even. Either way, it is the piece of cardboard directly under the beads that makes for a great, flat rosette.

There's one rosette maker on this board whose work is fantastic. If you folks want to talk about rosettes, ask Little One.

BeadedPony 09-16-2000 01:56 AM

Before someone jumps in and tells me I've missed a type of rosette, I'll say there are actually 3 -- the two I mentioned above, and then the lazy stitched round ones (Lakota) that are found on blanket strips.

Just covering my..uh...well, y'all know what I mean.

Little One~ 09-16-2000 01:59 AM

Only one comment, 'cause everyone else seems to have this down pat. For those that use cardboard, consider the method mentioned where you use some kind of fabric behind the cardboard and stitch through it as well, whether that's felt or canvas or what have you. I do this as a failsafe so that if, gasp, the piece ever happens to get wet, It won't be lost because the cardboard disintegrated.

Thank you, BeadedPony.

NancyJo 09-26-2000 06:09 PM

Hi, Just thought I'd throw in my 2 cents also. Cut out a piece of plastic (like from a butter bowl lid ...I like to use the lids off Pringles chips cans) slightly smaller than your finished rosette, and slip it in between your finished rosette and leather. Keeps your rosettes shape and won't bend. Great to hear all the other suggestions...I picked up a couple of new ideas here to try. Thanks http://www.powwows.com/ubb/wink.gif See ya latter!

RW 09-26-2000 06:45 PM

Right on Nancey Jo! I use thoughs yogurt cup and pringles lids, Heck just about any plastic lid for my medicine wheel bases.
They work really well and dont worp, when they get wet!
Chi pisa!
rich

RW 09-27-2000 01:52 AM

WOW! you guys are inspiring me to start beadin again! I made small madalions or rosets using that fiber paper envelopes the Post office has. It doest strech and its all thin adn fiberuous so it doest tear threw to much... I used small beads and backed it when I was using size 10 or 11, but it worked well for the smaller ones. the cool thing about that paper whas that you could draw on it, and hoop it. Anyhow, thanks for all the great Ideas..I got to got lazy stich my mooseskin moccs I making, but after thats done, Rossette time! http://www.powwows.com/ubb/biggrin.gif
Take care
Rich


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