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Old 02-12-2018, 05:45 PM   #41
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If I look in the mirror and see that Iím 6í01 but the government and people on a site say Iím 5í00Ē. Am I sill 6í01?
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Old 02-12-2018, 05:51 PM   #42
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Are those nazis? lol. I wonder if my German Shephard is a German Shephard. Heís black, tan, and looks like a German Shephard but he was born here. Is he still a German Shephard? Does his large amount of German shephard dna make him look the way he does? He isnít ďAMERICAN kennel clubĒ certified, is he still a German shephard with or without a paper proving this? He looks exactly like my akc German shephard. I donít think Imma call the non enrolled German shephard German anymore. Just shephard. Only my enrolled shephard will be German shephard lol. Because Akc recognizes him. Hahahahaha
How can one mixed person ever question another mixed persons identity? Lmao
Is there anyone on this site that is 100% Indian/ Native?
If not, weíre all in the same boat. Canít we all just get along.
I always thought a German Shepherd was someone who took take of the sheep in Germany.
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Old 02-12-2018, 05:54 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by OLChemist View Post
Hey, @JiuJitsuFighter I'd appreciate your input on the thread below.

The Term Native American and Indigenous Peoples the Caribbean and Lat. America

@LizBrokenArrow you too, please :)
Okay @OLChemist, You asked. Here goes:

1)What does the term "Native American" mean to you?
It means being a part of my family's culture, their faith, their customs, their stories, their way of living, the way they love, the way they forgive, the way they are giving of themselves, their teachings, their ceremonies, their traditions, their food, the way they survive living on a rez as oppose to living in the comforts that some of us grew up in, the way the make their tools with their hands, all of the history and legacy that they can give me to pass down to my children and their childrens' children, and the list goes on and on. I visited my mom this weekend. She's 81 and has dementia, but she remembers and showed me two handheld Indian drums that one of her uncles made. I asked her if I can have them. She said sure. She said when she dies, I can have one and my sister can have the other. LOL. She showed me pictures too. I was amazed. She doesn't always remember, but she did this weekend a little. Enough to show me a few things. There's so much more. There is so much more for me to learn that I don't know that they will teach me and that I can pass down to my children and grandchildren. It's overwhelming in a good way. I do not have all of the answers to this question because I am still learning.

2)What does it mean to be included within the definition? Excluded?
It means so much to be included because it finally shows me that I am part of a family, a real family, that I matter, and that I do have a purpose. And before anyone makes assumptions, please let me say why. ***Now please, do not not not feel sorry for me. I do not not not want a pity party because I am not a pity party person. But I grew up in an abusive home. On top of that, I was molested as a child and raped as an adult. I am a survivor. I am a domestic violence survivor as well. My first husband nearly killed me. So feeling excluded by family, that was normal for me. I was a numb and empty shell for a very long time. Being excluded meant absolutely nothing to me until I met my second husband and started a family.*** So when I found out about my Native family, heck yeah, I was on a mission to find out everything I could no matter what the cost. No matter the ridicule. I did. So to be included, within the definition, it's an honor for me. I cannot form the words to express exactly what it means to me. I do not take it lightly. It is a big responsibility for me, and I do not take it for granted either.

3) Do you assign some political or legal import to being included?
When I first began my journey, I was confused about this. As I continued researching and began learning more about my family, no. The answer is no. I do not assign any legalities or political import to being included. It is not important. It doesn't matter. It does not define who I am or where I come from. I know who I am and that is all that matters.
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Old 02-12-2018, 06:13 PM   #44
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If the government doesnít recognize me as native am I still Native?
If the government doesn't recognize me as a Native am I still native?
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Old 02-12-2018, 06:31 PM   #45
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I always thought a German Shepherd was someone who took take of the sheep in Germany.
Hahahahaha.


Seriously though their excellent dogs.
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Old 02-12-2018, 06:35 PM   #46
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If the government doesn't recognize me as a Native am I still native?
We may never know whoís native or who isnít Native?
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Old 02-12-2018, 06:37 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by LizBrokenArrow View Post
Okay @OLChemist, You asked. Here goes:

1)What does the term "Native American" mean to you?
It means being a part of my family's culture, their faith, their customs, their stories, their way of living, the way they love, the way they forgive, the way they are giving of themselves, their teachings, their ceremonies, their traditions, their food, the way they survive living on a rez as oppose to living in the comforts that some of us grew up in, the way the make their tools with their hands, all of the history and legacy that they can give me to pass down to my children and their childrens' children, and the list goes on and on. I visited my mom this weekend. She's 81 and has dementia, but she remembers and showed me two handheld Indian drums that one of her uncles made. I asked her if I can have them. She said sure. She said when she dies, I can have one and my sister can have the other. LOL. She showed me pictures too. I was amazed. She doesn't always remember, but she did this weekend a little. Enough to show me a few things. There's so much more. There is so much more for me to learn that I don't know that they will teach me and that I can pass down to my children and grandchildren. It's overwhelming in a good way. I do not have all of the answers to this question because I am still learning.

2)What does it mean to be included within the definition? Excluded?
It means so much to be included because it finally shows me that I am part of a family, a real family, that I matter, and that I do have a purpose. And before anyone makes assumptions, please let me say why. ***Now please, do not not not feel sorry for me. I do not not not want a pity party because I am not a pity party person. But I grew up in an abusive home. On top of that, I was molested as a child and raped as an adult. I am a survivor. I am a domestic violence survivor as well. My first husband nearly killed me. So feeling excluded by family, that was normal for me. I was a numb and empty shell for a very long time. Being excluded meant absolutely nothing to me until I met my second husband and started a family.*** So when I found out about my Native family, heck yeah, I was on a mission to find out everything I could no matter what the cost. No matter the ridicule. I did. So to be included, within the definition, it's an honor for me. I cannot form the words to express exactly what it means to me. I do not take it lightly. It is a big responsibility for me, and I do not take it for granted either.

3) Do you assign some political or legal import to being included?
When I first began my journey, I was confused about this. As I continued researching and began learning more about my family, no. The answer is no. I do not assign any legalities or political import to being included. It is not important. It doesn't matter. It does not define who I am or where I come from. I know who I am and that is all that matters.
Iím just stirring stuff up lol. Iím bored.

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Old 02-12-2018, 06:41 PM   #48
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I wonder if my German Shephard is a German Shephard. Heís black, tan, and looks like a German Shephard but he was born here. Is he still a German Shephard? Does his large amount of German shephard dna make him look the way he does? He isnít ďAMERICAN kennel clubĒ certified, is he still a German shephard with or without a paper proving this? He looks exactly like my akc German shephard. I donít think Imma call the non enrolled German shephard German anymore. Just shephard. Only my enrolled shephard will be German shephard lol. Because Akc recognizes him. Hahahahaha
Do you have any idea just how offensive the above is?

Tribal enrollment criteria are established by the tribes not the feds. Tribes have always had methods by which they determined membership -- even before the lost white guy. Exercise of this control over their membership is an aspect of tribal sovereignty. Sovereignty matters in Indian Country. Sovereignty is the firewall against political and cultural extinction.

Whether or not you like the criteria is one thing. There is a place for legitimate discussion of the implications of various means of determining membership. There is a legitimate place for discussion tribal naturalization. But, comparing tribal citizens -- that is what enrolled people are -- to dogs is not constructive. It's practically a page out of the dominant culture termination playbook.

Again, "hechel lena oyate kin nipi kte." Be careful. Be mindful. Community first, individual second. We i'eska have to remember, we too have a duty to protect what we are claiming. Our enemies listen to this kind of talk and vote with it in mind.
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Old 02-12-2018, 06:48 PM   #49
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Do you have any idea just how offensive the above is?

Tribal enrollment criteria are established by the tribes not the feds. Tribes have always had methods by which they determined membership -- even before the lost white guy. Exercise of this control over their membership is an aspect of tribal sovereignty. Sovereignty matters in Indian Country. Sovereignty is the firewall against political and cultural extinction.

Whether or not you like the criteria is one thing. There is a place for legitimate discussion of the implications of various means of determining membership. There is a legitimate place for discussion tribal naturalization. But, comparing tribal citizens -- that is what enrolled people are -- to dogs is not constructive. It's practically a page out of the dominant culture termination playbook.

Again, "hechel lena oyate kin nipi kte." Be careful. Be mindful. Community first, individual second. We i'eska have to remember, we too have a duty to protect what we are claiming. Our enemies listen to this kind of talk and vote with it in mind.
Hey, your right. Iím Sorry.
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Old 02-12-2018, 06:52 PM   #50
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Old 02-12-2018, 07:00 PM   #51
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I’m just stirring stuff up lol. I’m bored.
Then chew on this for a while. How do you (the collective you, not the specific you) construct a Native identity without knowing your tribe? Without a home community what then do you do to be Indian? Activism? Service? What do you build to resist the final act of colonization?

I think this is an important thought exercise for the displaced and dislocated. There is a place in our communities for allies. How are you an ally?
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Old 02-12-2018, 09:32 PM   #52
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Then chew on this for a while. How do you (the collective you, not the specific you) construct a Native identity without knowing your tribe? Without a home community what then do you do to be Indian? Activism? Service? What do you build to resist the final act of colonization?

I think this is an important thought exercise for the displaced and dislocated. There is a place in our communities for allies. How are you an ally?
How is someone who probably has more European blood typing on this forum making anyone explain themselves about being Indian. Thatís comical.
You should explain to me how someone who has a lot more European blood and maybe a spec of Indian blood goes around saying there Indian..how do you do that?????? I would feel weird...and Iím sorry if I offend anyone because their some cool folks on here but how do you do that??? How? Really! How? Iím lost... how do the tables turn like that and anyone has to explain to you?
Iím done with this subject.
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Old 02-12-2018, 09:56 PM   #53
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I'm sorry that post was poorly worded. But the you was collective not specific. I didn't mean to sound so accusatory.

What I was trying to solicit was you input on following. We have all agreed that there are people who are of native descent by don't know what tribe, therefore have no way to reconnect with their traditions. There is no generic Indian culture. There is no genetic knowledge. So what then does this mean in their life? How do they act on being Indian?

As for the European blood, I is who I is. I know my family and tribe. I know what I have been taught. Is that enough? For some, including me. Not enough for others. But I've been called a white woman before, and will again -- by people who's opinion I actually care about :)
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Old 02-12-2018, 10:10 PM   #54
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I'm sorry that post was poorly worded. But the you was collective not specific. I didn't mean to sound so accusatory.

What I was trying to solicit was you input on following. We have all agreed that there are people who are of native descent by don't know what tribe, therefore have no way to reconnect with their traditions. There is no generic Indian culture. There is no genetic knowledge. So what then does this mean in their life? How do they act on being Indian?
Honestly, I have no clue what they would do. You canít make stuff up. And if your of Indian descent then just be you. Just be yourself.
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Old 02-13-2018, 12:38 AM   #55
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Honestly, I have no clue what they would do. You canít make stuff up. And if your of Indian descent then just be you. Just be yourself.
People make stuff up all the time. Look around at some of the dances , they're always doin' goofy stuff.
In 2008 I met Ol'C at a powwow in Austin . Introductions and a short visit,as I was dancing , saw her again in 2009. I've seen her work in regalia pieces , reproduction museum pieces , and I wish my work could compare ! Her cultural knowledge is first rate , she knows the dos and don'ts. Respect , Our culture is based on respect ! Pass on knowledge to the next generation , and yes , teach them respect. Without that , we're nothing.
Something my Grandmother told me when I was very young. I asked about me being a half-breed. She looked right in my eyes and told me "you're either ndn or you're not." So right then I never questioned it again.
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I believe blood quantums are the governments way to breed us out of existance !


They say blood is thicker than water ! Now maple syrup is thicker than blood , so are pancakes more important than family ?

There are "Elders" and there are "Olders". Being the second one doesn't make the first one true !

Somebody is out there somewhere, thinking of you and the impact you made in their life.
It's not me....I think you're an idiot !





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Old 02-13-2018, 04:04 AM   #56
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People make stuff up all the time. Look around at some of the dances , they're always doin' goofy stuff.
In 2008 I met Ol'C at a powwow in Austin . Introductions and a short visit,as I was dancing , saw her again in 2009. I've seen her work in regalia pieces , reproduction museum pieces , and I wish my work could compare ! Her cultural knowledge is first rate , she knows the dos and don'ts. Respect , Our culture is based on respect ! Pass on knowledge to the next generation , and yes , teach them respect. Without that , we're nothing.
Something my Grandmother told me when I was very young. I asked about me being a half-breed. She looked right in my eyes and told me "you're either ndn or you're not." So right then I never questioned it again.
Yeah, respect is key. Iím sure her work is legit. Iím also sure everyone on here are cool people. We need to come up with more topics/ discussions.
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Old 02-13-2018, 07:43 AM   #57
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Yeah, respect is key. Iím sure her work is legit. Iím also sure everyone on here are cool people. We need to come up with more topics/ discussions.
After being on this site 14 - 20 years, you run out of things to say. You see them come and go.

JiuJitsuFighter, what United States tribe do you identify with?
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Why must I feel like that..why must I chase the cat?


"When I was young man I did some dumb things and the elders would talk to me. Sometimes I listened. Time went by and as I looked around...I was the elder".

Mr. Rossie Freeman
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Old 02-13-2018, 06:43 PM   #58
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After being on this site 14 - 20 years, you run out of things to say. You see them come and go.

JiuJitsuFighter, what United States tribe do you identify with?
O.G. You know this already. You tryin to set me up for some trash talkin lol. You know weíre my family is from and still are present day...present day.....I identify with my family.
This entire topic is old already. But I donít wanna be rude and ignore you. Got respect for you O.G. JD...
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:02 PM   #59
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O.G. You know this already. You tryin to set me up for some trash talkin lol. You know weíre my family is from and still are present day...present day.....I identify with my family.
This entire topic is old already. But I donít wanna be rude and ignore you. Got respect for you O.G. JD...
The Level 4 guys at Corcoran hug me. LOL
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Why must I feel like that..why must I chase the cat?


"When I was young man I did some dumb things and the elders would talk to me. Sometimes I listened. Time went by and as I looked around...I was the elder".

Mr. Rossie Freeman
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:49 PM   #60
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The Level 4 guys at Corcoran hug me. LOL
Lmfao. That actually made me smile lol..
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