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Old 09-25-2017, 04:38 PM   #21
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@eagleclanriverband and all who have given me feedback here.

So I came across this site 500 Nations and they show the federally recognized tribes and for the State of New Jersey where I am at: There's a Taino Tribe listed. I will be reaching out to them for information and information on being a Federally recognized tribe, so please explain if you still believe that we Taino's are not recognized in NJ? Again, I am going to reach out to them and hope that they will give me the info I need, but could it be possible that you are wrong on this one? Some do live in what we call reservations. In Puerto Rico they're called "Settlements" and they live in Huts made from what looks like sticks and straw. With the disaster in Puerto Rico that's occurring now, I'm sure by now you know that Puerto Rico was hit hard and destroyed by Hurricanes Irma and Maria, it will be nearly impossible for me to get some info directly from PR anytime soon, however, the info I have found so far seems legit.

500 Nations: Click here (Taino Jatibonuco Tribe of Puerto Rico) to see the New Jersey federally recognized tribes.

Click here (Current Taino Tribes and Settlements in Puerto Rico). This Taino Webstie from Puerto Rico has loads of info on their tribes. The tribes are still there. Maybe not all of them, but there are still active Taino Tribes in PR.

Now don't get mad at me. In a short amount of time, you all just taught me how to do some searches on google, and so far I got a lot more info today.

Please correct me if I'm wrong. I appreciate honesty. Don't hold back. If I am wrong, I am wrong, but please include your sources so I can keep researching and learning. Thanks.

Peace and Blessings.
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Old 09-26-2017, 06:38 AM   #22
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500 Nations includes state recognized tribes and heritage organizations in their by state lists.

You need to be careful of the sources. A lot of information on the internet is of dubious worth. You also need to read things a bit more throughly; it is very easy to find what you want rather than what is true. Especially for Indian tribes and culture.

I know, not believe, that the Taino groups are not-federally recognized because they are not on the list in the 2017 Federal Register. I know they are not state-recognized because I've read the background information for the ongoing Lenni-Lenape v NJ.

The Federal Register is the gold standard for government legal info. The list below is what federal agencies will use for determining what tribes have federal recognition.

2017 List of Federal Recognized Tribes -- US Federal Register

Just in case there is an omission in the 2017 list you can check the 2016 or earlier.

2016 List of Federally Recognized Tribes -- US Federal Register

According to the GAO in 2012, no official list of state recognized tribes exists. However, the sources below are from reasonably thorough and knowledgeable entities.

Federal and State Recognized Tribes -- National Conference of State Legislatures

GAO Report on Federal Funding for Non-Federally Recognized Tribes, 2012


The situation in NJ is muddied. The state of NJ claims never to have formally recognized 3 tribes (none Taino) and tribes claim otherwise. There is an ongoing law suit.

Law 306 article on Lenni-Lenap v. NJ _ Cultural Heritage Partners &

This is from the law firm either handling the case or consulting on it:

Cultural Heritage Partner's -- info on Lenni-Lanape v NJ

Further, none of the three tribes that claim to have been state recognized in NJ are Taino.

Last edited by OLChemist; 09-26-2017 at 06:52 AM..
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Old 09-26-2017, 07:24 AM   #23
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Further, Tainos entered the US body politic in the 1890's -- after the Indian Appropriation Act of March 3, 1871, which ended treaty making and changed the legal definition of Indian individuals. There could be no treaties made between the US and the Taino of PR. Without that treaty, there is no government to government relationship between the Taino and US.

Treaties are between nations. There aren't generic treaties between all Indians and the US. Each was between a tribe or block of tribes. Subsequent law and custom has unified aspects of these relations -- like how educational and health service promised under treaty are provided. But an individual Indian's relationship to the feds arises from his membership within his tribe.

Liz, this isn't about saying "we're in and you're out." This is not a game of one-upsmanship. It is about a matter that goes to the heart of the political construction of Native identity. Like I said earlier, treaties are important. This complex political status is a legacy of those treaties. It is an acknowledgment of our various nations' sovereignty. Sovereignty is a life-blood issue in Indian Country.

Please understand, Native identity has political and cultural components. Cards, federal and state recognition are parts of political Indianess.


If I had to guess your apparently desperate search for a some political group to join is more of a reflection of a feeling of inauthenticity. Again, paper doesn't make an Indian; Indians make Indians. The heart of cultural Indianess is family, clan (if your folks count things that way), and community. These are what make you Indian. These are in your family.

Last edited by OLChemist; 09-26-2017 at 07:27 AM.. Reason: Dang auto-correct. Mr Computer, you can't read my mind because the print is too blurry.
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Old 09-26-2017, 04:06 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OLChemist View Post
500 Nations includes state recognized tribes and heritage organizations in their by state lists.

You need to be careful of the sources. A lot of information on the internet is of dubious worth. You also need to read things a bit more throughly; it is very easy to find what you want rather than what is true. Especially for Indian tribes and culture.

I know, not believe, that the Taino groups are not-federally recognized because they are not on the list in the 2017 Federal Register. I know they are not state-recognized because I've read the background information for the ongoing Lenni-Lenape v NJ.

The Federal Register is the gold standard for government legal info. The list below is what federal agencies will use for determining what tribes have federal recognition.

2017 List of Federal Recognized Tribes -- US Federal Register

Just in case there is an omission in the 2017 list you can check the 2016 or earlier.

2016 List of Federally Recognized Tribes -- US Federal Register

According to the GAO in 2012, no official list of state recognized tribes exists. However, the sources below are from reasonably thorough and knowledgeable entities.

Federal and State Recognized Tribes -- National Conference of State Legislatures

GAO Report on Federal Funding for Non-Federally Recognized Tribes, 2012


The situation in NJ is muddied. The state of NJ claims never to have formally recognized 3 tribes (none Taino) and tribes claim otherwise. There is an ongoing law suit.

Law 306 article on Lenni-Lenap v. NJ _ Cultural Heritage Partners &

This is from the law firm either handling the case or consulting on it:

Cultural Heritage Partner's -- info on Lenni-Lanape v NJ

Further, none of the three tribes that claim to have been state recognized in NJ are Taino.
Oh wow OLChemist, this is a lot of info. I am so grateful.

Thank you so much for all of this. You gave me a lot to read and it will take me days, but this is good.

Thank you so much. I appreciate all of this. You have no idea how much.
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Liz Broken Arrow

I am looking to join a Pow Wow dance team in Bergen County New Jersey or surrounding area. Dance Style: Jingle Dancing.



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Old 09-26-2017, 04:31 PM   #25
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Further, Tainos entered the US body politic in the 1890's -- after the Indian Appropriation Act of March 3, 1871, which ended treaty making and changed the legal definition of Indian individuals. There could be no treaties made between the US and the Taino of PR. Without that treaty, there is no government to government relationship between the Taino and US.

Treaties are between nations. There aren't generic treaties between all Indians and the US. Each was between a tribe or block of tribes. Subsequent law and custom has unified aspects of these relations -- like how educational and health service promised under treaty are provided. But an individual Indian's relationship to the feds arises from his membership within his tribe.

Liz, this isn't about saying "we're in and you're out." This is not a game of one-upsmanship. It is about a matter that goes to the heart of the political construction of Native identity. Like I said earlier, treaties are important. This complex political status is a legacy of those treaties. It is an acknowledgment of our various nations' sovereignty. Sovereignty is a life-blood issue in Indian Country.

Please understand, Native identity has political and cultural components. Cards, federal and state recognition are parts of political Indianess.


If I had to guess your apparently desperate search for a some political group to join is more of a reflection of a feeling of inauthenticity. Again, paper doesn't make an Indian; Indians make Indians. The heart of cultural Indianess is family, clan (if your folks count things that way), and community. These are what make you Indian. These are in your family.
OLChemist. Thank you for your frankness. I very much appreciate your honesty. I appreciate you not dancing around things to spare my feelings. I am grateful for that. It's a welcome change to everyone else being shady and vague.

I understand that you're not telling me that you're in and I'm out. Never crossed my mind. I'm here to learn. If I am right, I'm right, and if I am wrong, I'm wrong. I would never know either if I didn't have people like you letting me know and explaining things to me in so much detail. And no, no "one-upmanship" here. Not my intent. Just sharing what little info I find out and asking for correction if the info found is incorrect.

You got one thing right and one thing wrong. Right: I am desperate trying to find out my family's information and where they're at. Wrong: Not looking for a political group to join. Dance group yes. Political group, no. "Feeling of inauthenticity, no. Just trying to find my family. I know they're out there. Just don't understand why my other family is trying so hard to keep me away from them. Do I want to be a part of my family. Of course, yes, definitely. I feel incomplete. I feel a void in my life and in my heart and I'd like to feel whole. I don't know if I make sense to you, if you understand what I mean. The more info I find out, even if it's incorrect info, I find the truth here, the paper has become irrelevant to me. It's not about the paper, it's about how I'm feeling inside. Knowing that my family's tribe is still out there and them keeping me away from them for whatever reason is making me more determined to find them. I don't know if I'll ever receive info from the place I sent my registration form to, but if I do, I'll share it and see if it's more incorrect info.

I know that eventually I'll have to fly to PR to get to the bottom of everything, In the meantime, I keep searching for answers. Thank you for helping me so much.
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Liz Broken Arrow

I am looking to join a Pow Wow dance team in Bergen County New Jersey or surrounding area. Dance Style: Jingle Dancing.



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Old 09-27-2017, 03:24 PM   #26
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Hi Joe's Dady, I am by no means like the white people trying to be posers. I am by no means "Trying so hard to belong" like you put it. (I know you weren't really referring to me by the way). But just so that you can know what I am doing here on this site, and why I ask questions, you need familiarize yourself with my journey here through my past posts, and on this thread as well. You will see that I am here on this site merely trying to learn and getting help on finding out my families history. I know that I am Taino. There's no question about that. Both sides of my parents, my grandparents, and great-grandparents, paternal/maternal, all Taino. So far, I know that my grandparents and great-grandparents and the grands before them all lived it. I know about who my grandparents and great-grand parents were from both sides of my family. When my grandparents passed away, that's when the family after that, the descendants abandoned the life and never spoke a word of it to any of us. I ask, they all change the topic, and are really shady and reluctant to answer any questions at all. Also, a lot of the family who would know, and probably would not had said anything anyway, have already passed away. I'd love to take a trip to PR, but I cannot until PR is restored from this devastating hurricane that tore the Island apart. So until then, I am here asking questions and learning since I do not have all of the answers. Yes, I get misinformation, but I don't know that it is misinformation until I come on here to ask questions about things that I have found out.

As for your comment that Taino's don't Jingle Dance. Yes, I know that. I know the type of dances that they do. I've seen it. I however, gravitated to Jingle Dancing. It's what I am learning. It's what I love. I don't think that there is anything wrong with that. If there is, let me know.

Peace and blessings Joe's Dad. Thank you for your comments and feedback.
Welcome to the site. Actually, I've been following most of your posts since the day you walked in. You haven't seen me because there are many others who will guide you in the right way and a polite way (OLC and eagleclanriverband among others).

What I was saying is find your people from Puerto Rico. Many PR tribes have cultures and heritage different than American Indians. I believe once you grasp your in visual culture (who you identify with), you may have no desire for follow the medicine dress.
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Why must I feel like that..why must I chase the cat?


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Old 09-27-2017, 05:06 PM   #27
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Ayeee I'm Taino!
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Last edited by sydnee; 09-28-2017 at 03:54 PM.. Reason: I realized that I could actually help
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Old 09-27-2017, 05:38 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by LizBrokenArrow View Post
Hi Everyone. Anyone know any of the locations of any Taino Tribes? I am looking for Cheif names or the names of anyone you may know who is active in their tribe, addresses, phone numbers, email address, anything that can help me connect with a live person. I'm especially interested in the Taino Tribes & active organizations of Puerto Rico. Nothing is coming up in google searches or anywhere else.

These are the names of the Taino Tribes:
1- Taino
2- Boriken Taino
3- Kiskeia Taino
4- Bohio Taino
5- Hibaro Taino
6- Sibonel Taino
7- Kuba Taino
8- Guahiro Taino
9- Hamaika Taino
10- Yamaye Taino
11- Taino Arawak
12- Kalinago
13- Karib
14- Lokono


Peace & Blessings
Liz
14. Lokono - Arawaks in Suriname and Guyana
12/13. Karib and kalinago are the same thing. They're in Dominica and are not arawaks
11. Taino Arawak is someone who is Taino. Also known as Island Arawaks but quite a few tainos just say Taino Arawak
10. Yamaye Taino - tainos from jamaica, usually mountain area
8 & 9 - Most likely Boriken Tainos but I'm not too sure
7. Cuban Taino
6. "Cave dwelers" Tainos from Western Cuba
5. Idk
4. Bohio means "home" not specific to any country of Taino descendents. This is not a tribe or people.
3. Dominican Taino
2. Puerto Rican Taino
1. Tainos are native to the Carribbean, heketiwa, we are one.

There is more to being Taino than just the blood. Always remember that.

The ones that I say "idk" to are very uncommonly heard. I spend alot of time reviving the language with other people along with helping others understand the culture so I speak based off what I know

None of these groups of people have reservations though you can find a significant population in the mountains.
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Last edited by sydnee; 09-28-2017 at 10:22 PM..
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Old 09-28-2017, 03:16 PM   #29
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Welcome to the site. Actually, I've been following most of your posts since the day you walked in. You haven't seen me because there are many others who will guide you in the right way and a polite way (OLC and eagleclanriverband among others).

What I was saying is find your people from Puerto Rico. Many PR tribes have cultures and heritage different than American Indians. I believe once you grasp your in visual culture (who you identify with), you may have no desire for follow the medicine dress.
Hi Joe's Dad. I understand what you're saying. And yes, that's what I am trying to do, to find my own people from PR. I was explaining in other posts that I keep hitting road blocks while trying to find my own people. My family from both my mother's side and father's side are not being supportive, but I don't care. I am determined and I am not going to stop. The more they try to sway me away, the more determined I get. I would love nothing more than to see how they live, their culture, what they do, etc, etc.

Now as for the medicine dress. The reason why I have a passion for it is because praying for people, laying hands on people and praying for their healing, that's what I do on the daily. I'm a prayer warrior. I pray for everyone, I go to hospitals to pray for the sick, I visit people in their homes who are sick, I visit people on their death bed, and I pray. So jingle dancing, the medicine dress, when I saw it for the first time, I knew it was for me, I related to it, my heart leaped, I felt one with it. And so, from that first time, I made it a mission to learn it. Now I do not know if that would change after I connect with my family and see them "do them" if that would diminish my desire for the "medicine dress" as you put it, but for now, I cannot completely express into words what jingle dancing means to me and how it really makes me feel inside my being, to my very soul. I don't know if you get what I'm trying to say. I have seen videos of my Taino people doing their dances, but it doesn't have the effect on me that Jingle Dancing has on me. Like you said though, I would have to see the "Visual" of my family culture and see how I identify with it.

I have a question for you. Please don't take it the wrong way. I'm hear to ask and learn so it's not personal or sarcastic or disrespectful, or anything of the sort. I now have to watch how I ask questions and make comments because people get sensitive here when I mean no harm. You said that "many PR tribes have cultures and heritage different than American Indians." Comment: Taino's, although they may have different cultures than other tribes in this nation, PR is a commonwealth/territory of the U.S. They are American Citizens. PR is a part of the U.S. Question: Therefore, doesn't that make Taino's "American Indians" as well? It's just a question that I need clarified. I mean, even the ones from Canada, Mexico and South America are also referred to as American Indian. So please clarify that for me. Gosh, I hope this question/ comment doesn't bring the lynch mob upon me here again. I come in peace.
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Peace and Blessings,
Liz Broken Arrow

I am looking to join a Pow Wow dance team in Bergen County New Jersey or surrounding area. Dance Style: Jingle Dancing.



God our Creator #1 in all we do always.
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Old 09-28-2017, 08:27 PM   #30
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Honestly, I was put off by all your Christian proselytizing in your earlier posts; so I chose to stay quiet. But I feel the need to speak up now because I think you are being misled by whatever group you filled out an application for “tribal registration” to.

I hope you understand that there is NO Taino & Carib Indian Tribe that is legally US Federally Recognized and that the PR Commonwealth Govt. does not officially recognize any Taino/Arawak & Carib Tribe on the Island either. This has nothing to do with your family & who your ancestors were. All PR Tainos aren't legally recognized by the BIA as an American Indian Tribe.

There are a number of Taino “social friendship clubs”, “cultural organizations” & “political action groups” (they call themselves different things); NONE of these groups/entities can offer you “tribal enrollment” that is LEGALLY considered by the US Govt./BIA to be as belonging to a US Federally Recognized American Indian Tribe.

The membership you are buying is basically no different than Sam’s Club or a gym membership. It’s akin to paying a fee to become a member of the Girl Scouts kind of thing. For example, I have ZERO Taino blood & if I pay $30/person to the United Confederation of Taino People, they would give me a membership & issue me what they call a “tribal id”.

There are a number of for-profit corporations & non-profit charities that use weasel words to make it look like they offer “tribal enrollment” in their "official registry" or what they call an "affiliate" to their "inter-tribal indigenous nations", but these are basically scams in that they cannot offer you membership/enrollment in any US Federally Recognized American Indian/Native American Tribe.

BTW…The reason why there are no reservations in PR & no treaties with Taino/Arawak/Caribs is because the US Military invaded, took it over & occupied Puerto Rico during the Spanish/American War in1898. After the war, the US Govt. acquired it as a possession from Spain as a concession.
I have seen a few groups do this. It annoys me so much.
Also, for many years tainos were thought to be dead because the Spanish stopped counting and just said they're all dead.
But DNA tests prove otherwise. So many tainos are aware that there is more to being Taino than just the blood and decided to not only show people that we exist but bring our culture back and our language :)
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Old 09-29-2017, 07:54 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by LizBrokenArrow View Post
Hi Joe's Dad. I understand what you're saying. And yes, that's what I am trying to do, to find my own people from PR. I was explaining in other posts that I keep hitting road blocks while trying to find my own people. My family from both my mother's side and father's side are not being supportive, but I don't care. I am determined and I am not going to stop. The more they try to sway me away, the more determined I get. I would love nothing more than to see how they live, their culture, what they do, etc, etc.

Now as for the medicine dress. The reason why I have a passion for it is because praying for people, laying hands on people and praying for their healing, that's what I do on the daily. I'm a prayer warrior. I pray for everyone, I go to hospitals to pray for the sick, I visit people in their homes who are sick, I visit people on their death bed, and I pray. So jingle dancing, the medicine dress, when I saw it for the first time, I knew it was for me, I related to it, my heart leaped, I felt one with it. And so, from that first time, I made it a mission to learn it. Now I do not know if that would change after I connect with my family and see them "do them" if that would diminish my desire for the "medicine dress" as you put it, but for now, I cannot completely express into words what jingle dancing means to me and how it really makes me feel inside my being, to my very soul. I don't know if you get what I'm trying to say. I have seen videos of my Taino people doing their dances, but it doesn't have the effect on me that Jingle Dancing has on me. Like you said though, I would have to see the "Visual" of my family culture and see how I identify with it.

I have a question for you. Please don't take it the wrong way. I'm hear to ask and learn so it's not personal or sarcastic or disrespectful, or anything of the sort. I now have to watch how I ask questions and make comments because people get sensitive here when I mean no harm. You said that "many PR tribes have cultures and heritage different than American Indians." Comment: Taino's, although they may have different cultures than other tribes in this nation, PR is a commonwealth/territory of the U.S. They are American Citizens. PR is a part of the U.S. Question: Therefore, doesn't that make Taino's "American Indians" as well? It's just a question that I need clarified. I mean, even the ones from Canada, Mexico and South America are also referred to as American Indian. So please clarify that for me. Gosh, I hope this question/ comment doesn't bring the lynch mob upon me here again. I come in peace.
Perhaps you confuse 'American Indians' with 'Indians of the Americas'.
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Old 10-02-2017, 02:09 PM   #32
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Perhaps you confuse 'American Indians' with 'Indians of the Americas'.
How so? Please explain. I don't understand what you mean. What am I doing wrong?
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Old 10-02-2017, 10:20 PM   #33
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How so? Please explain. I don't understand what you mean. What am I doing wrong?
There are those here who are much more qualified to answer you. WhoMe, Josiah, wardander, OLChemist and many more.

I believe if your tribe does do not have DIRECT communications with the U.S. Government and the Bureau of Indian Affairs (as WhoMe says, 'the land of 470 broken treaties), then your tribe may not be recognize as American Indian. You will find many ' State Recognized' tribes who do not meet the criteria within the statutes of the government, but are American Indians.

I do not know of any 'American Indian' tribe being able to have dialogue with governments outside on the United Stated, or as many know it 'Ameica'.
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Old 10-03-2017, 03:03 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Joe's Dad View Post
There are those here who are much more qualified to answer you. WhoMe, Josiah, wardander, OLChemist and many more.

I believe if your tribe does do not have DIRECT communications with the U.S. Government and the Bureau of Indian Affairs (as WhoMe says, 'the land of 470 broken treaties), then your tribe may not be recognize as American Indian. You will find many ' State Recognized' tribes who do not meet the criteria within the statutes of the government, but are American Indians.

I do not know of any 'American Indian' tribe being able to have dialogue with governments outside on the United Stated, or as many know it 'Ameica'.
Thank you for explaining Joe's Dad. I guess that is something else that I have to dig into and find out because I honestly do not know yet.

If anyone here on this thread has any feedback on this, I'd appreciate it.

Thanks again Joe's Dad.
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Old 10-04-2017, 03:39 PM   #35
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Liz, you're getting hung up in definitions. In the US, American Indian is a slippery term. It has political and ethnological meanings. The scope of who is and who is not an American Indian is context dependent.

"As a general rule, an American Indian or Alaska Native person is someone who has blood degree from and is recognized as such by a federally recognized[emphasis added] tribe or village (as an enrolled tribal member) and/or the United States. Of course, blood quantum (the degree of American Indian or Alaska Native blood from a federally recognized tribe or village that a person possesses) is not the only means by which a person is considered to be an American Indian or Alaska Native. Other factors, such as a person’s knowledge of his or her tribe’s culture, history, language, religion, familial kinships, and how strongly a person identifies himself or herself as American Indian or Alaska Native, are also important. In fact, there is no single federal or tribal criterion or standard that establishes a person's identity as American Indian or Alaska Native."

quote from BIA FAQ's

Virtually every governmental entity which deals with Native Americans has it's own definition. These vary, but almost all of them include membership in a tribal group with a government to government relationship with the US federal government (or in some few cases state governments).

These blog post include a laundry list of definitions:

What is an Indian? A Legal Definition, Part 1

What is an Indian? A Legal Definition, Part 2

As several of us have told you, Tainos are not federally recognized. Nor are they state recognized. Further the relationship of PR to the US is not a fed to state relationship. PR is an unincorporated territory. This makes any current government to government relationship between the Taino and the feds unlikely in the extreme.

Why are you fighting this hard? No one is saying you're not indigenous/Native. All I've heard said, is your tribe has no government to government relationship with the US. All I've heard is a mild suggestion that once you know your people's culture better, you may come to find dancing a medicine dance originating with the Anishinaabeg inappropriate or unsatisfying.

I would suggest you energies could be better spent learning the history of your people. Get off the web and go find some real books. Start with Fray Ramon Pane's An Account of the Antiquities of the Indians Duke University Press, 1999 and Peter Mayter's De orbe novo decades

PDF of English translation of De orbe novo decades

Once you know what the colonizer has to say, read what modern scholars have to say. Then go home and ask your people. Look with Taino eyes at what you read.
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Old 10-04-2017, 03:58 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by OLChemist View Post
Liz, you're getting hung up in definitions. In the US, American Indian is a slippery term. It has political and ethnological meanings. The scope of who is and who is not an American Indian is context dependent.

"As a general rule, an American Indian or Alaska Native person is someone who has blood degree from and is recognized as such by a federally recognized[emphasis added] tribe or village (as an enrolled tribal member) and/or the United States. Of course, blood quantum (the degree of American Indian or Alaska Native blood from a federally recognized tribe or village that a person possesses) is not the only means by which a person is considered to be an American Indian or Alaska Native. Other factors, such as a person’s knowledge of his or her tribe’s culture, history, language, religion, familial kinships, and how strongly a person identifies himself or herself as American Indian or Alaska Native, are also important. In fact, there is no single federal or tribal criterion or standard that establishes a person's identity as American Indian or Alaska Native."

quote from BIA FAQ's

Virtually every governmental entity which deals with Native Americans has it's own definition. These vary, but almost all of them include membership in a tribal group with a government to government relationship with the US federal government (or in some few cases state governments).

These blog post include a laundry list of definitions:

What is an Indian? A Legal Definition, Part 1

What is an Indian? A Legal Definition, Part 2

As several of us have told you, Tainos are not federally recognized. Nor are they state recognized. Further the relationship of PR to the US is not a fed to state relationship. PR is an unincorporated territory. This makes any current government to government relationship between the Taino and the feds unlikely in the extreme.

Why are you fighting this hard? No one is saying you're not indigenous/Native. All I've heard said, is your tribe has no government to government relationship with the US. All I've heard is a mild suggestion that once you know your people's culture better, you may come to find dancing a medicine dance originating with the Anishinaabeg inappropriate or unsatisfying.

I would suggest you energies could be better spent learning the history of your people. Get off the web and go find some real books. Start with Fray Ramon Pane's An Account of the Antiquities of the Indians Duke University Press, 1999 and Peter Mayter's De orbe novo decades

PDF of English translation of De orbe novo decades

Once you know what the colonizer has to say, read what modern scholars have to say. Then go home and ask your people. Look with Taino eyes at what you read.
Thank you for your feedback OLChemist. Not hung up on definition per say. Just needed to know the difference from what Joe's Dad had quoted to me "Perhaps you confuse 'American Indians' with 'Indians of the Americas', and I was just asking for clarification as to what the difference is since I did not know. That's all.

As always, thank you for the links for me to review. I always appreciate that. I will also look into the books you mentioned as well.

Thanks again
Liz
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I am looking to join a Pow Wow dance team in Bergen County New Jersey or surrounding area. Dance Style: Jingle Dancing.



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