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Old 01-16-2007, 10:37 PM   #1
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Meaning behind the song

Dear brothers and sisters!

I would appreciate hearing your thoughts when you hear traditional music. How do you feel when you hear the music? What makes you feel that way? Do you understand your tribes songs? If so, would you be willing to share the meaning with us?

I think that this would be very inspirational for all of us to discuss, if you are willing.

Thank you.

Wyawaqacumen
The Bearman
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Old 01-16-2007, 11:51 PM   #2
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by trad im assuming you mean OTHER THAN POWWOW songs.

When I hear a memorial song that is sung right and I understand the words, it actually makes me sad. They are put together to sound like they SHOULD BE a memorial song.
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Old 01-23-2007, 01:17 PM   #3
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Knowing the words to a song allows the dancer to understand what the song is about, why it was created, and most importantly, how to dance to it.

Some Lakota songs and translations below will help illustrate my point.

Intertribal Pow-Wow Song (Wacipi Olowan)

Iyokipic'iya wau welo.
Akis'as'a, winyunskinyan, kola, waunci yelo.
Wokiksuyin ktelo.
Was'agya waunci yelo.


I come to enjoy myself.
Shouting, joyfully, friend, we are dancing together.
There will be memories.
Strongly we are dancing together.


Rabbit Dance Love Song (Isna Wastekicilapi Mastin Olowan)

Tokiyatan yahi so.
Leciyatanhan waci wahiye.
Nape au we.
Tansna waun we.
Toksa ake wacinyankin kte.


Say, where did you come from?
Oh, I come from that way to dance here.
Give me your hand, because I am single.
Maybe I will see you later.


Penny Song (Mazasa Olowan)

Tuwela seca k 'un heye lo.
Ina wancala imacagin kta keyin na ohunkesni
kinhan wawokiyesmasi yelo.


Someone said,
my mother told me that I will be born only once
so she encouraged me to help all unfortunate people.


Dancing Woman Honor Song (Waci Winyan K'un Olowan)

Waci winyan k'un, inanjin nan hiyu wo!
Kola heya pelo,
Leciya, oskate wan tehikelo.


Dancing woman, stand and come this way!
Friends are saying,
Over here, a celebration is having a difficult time.


Memorial Song (Wicat 'a Wokiksuye Olowan)

Oyate kinhan kawitaya au yunkan
tuwela seca k'un hel opa sni yelo.
Nita kola heyape lo.


When people come to a celebration,
someone is not among them.
Your friends have said so.
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Old 01-23-2007, 05:56 PM   #4
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Old 01-23-2007, 07:03 PM   #5
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Thank you

Dear Historian,

Thank you very much for taking the time to share this with us. I know little about the Lakota people, but what I do know, I am honored to have been included and to have learned.

On the East Coast, it is difficult for many tribes to know their language. In the case of the Lenape people, we have a good amount of scholarship available to us to learn Lenape, however very few people of the Wenetko Lenape do that. The language is practically dead for us here on the East Coast.

For me, that's sad because I do know a little and have done some research to learn some Lenape, but I can't learn it well because no one else around me knows it well.

I certainly hope that never happens with Lakota. It's a very famous language though I think, like Navajo. You have Kevin Costner to thank for that. I think any and everyone that's even half curious about native culture knows the word "tatanka."

That's pretty good advertising for the Lakota I'd say!

Thanks again my Lakota friend. This is meaningful to me and I certainly would like to learn more.

I am sincerely

Wyawaqacumen,
the bearman,
born next to the Salmon People and the Raven.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Historian View Post
Knowing the words to a song allows the dancer to understand what the song is about, why it was created, and most importantly, how to dance to it.

Some Lakota songs and translations below will help illustrate my point.

Intertribal Pow-Wow Song (Wacipi Olowan)

Iyokipic'iya wau welo.
Akis'as'a, winyunskinyan, kola, waunci yelo.
Wokiksuyin ktelo.
Was'agya waunci yelo.


I come to enjoy myself.
Shouting, joyfully, friend, we are dancing together.
There will be memories.
Strongly we are dancing together.


Rabbit Dance Love Song (Isna Wastekicilapi Mastin Olowan)

Tokiyatan yahi so.
Leciyatanhan waci wahiye.
Nape au we.
Tansna waun we.
Toksa ake wacinyankin kte.


Say, where did you come from?
Oh, I come from that way to dance here.
Give me your hand, because I am single.
Maybe I will see you later.


Penny Song (Mazasa Olowan)

Tuwela seca k 'un heye lo.
Ina wancala imacagin kta keyin na ohunkesni
kinhan wawokiyesmasi yelo.


Someone said,
my mother told me that I will be born only once
so she encouraged me to help all unfortunate people.


Dancing Woman Honor Song (Waci Winyan K'un Olowan)

Waci winyan k'un, inanjin nan hiyu wo!
Kola heya pelo,
Leciya, oskate wan tehikelo.


Dancing woman, stand and come this way!
Friends are saying,
Over here, a celebration is having a difficult time.


Memorial Song (Wicat 'a Wokiksuye Olowan)

Oyate kinhan kawitaya au yunkan
tuwela seca k'un hel opa sni yelo.
Nita kola heyape lo.


When people come to a celebration,
someone is not among them.
Your friends have said so.
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Old 01-23-2007, 11:33 PM   #6
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Now, I will share what I hear. Crow words to us.

Dear brothers and sisters,

Tonight, I listened to one song, a single Crow Hop from a recording I have and I want to share my thoughts of tradition and of lessons that can be learned from this song.

This is my interpretation and I don’t mean to suggest that it is a tradition of the Crow people. It is my worlds and my words that now speak, as I, bearman and Manito gifted man, sits in my understanding of old ways and how they can be interpreted.

I don’t want to offend or mislead my friends here either. I am touched, but in a different way than your spirit walkers were touched. Still, I come to the tribes and I want them to teach me, because you also are wise.

I respect your thoughts and traditions as well and I honor them, as you have honored me by allowing me voice on your forum. I hope we can continue to make each other wiser, as the great Manito would have us try. He is father sky and the turtle is mother earth and we all are just visitors here. Let our journey also be one that finds spiritual guidance from time to time and let us be at peace.

This is my truest way.

This is what I hear. May I honor the Crow in my words:

Drums start, they are the unison of the people coming together, as one, speaking with one voice.

A single man speaks. He speaks for the group: he is the leader and the way. He speaks happy thoughts and wants every one to be happy. The group responds and they say I agree; we are happy. They don’t just say thanks, they explain why. They are thankful for the day, for the night, for the rain, for the cold, for the sun, for the moon, for everything that great Manito has given them.

I too agree with them.

They repeat their song. They say it again. They are truly grateful and they honor the world around them and they honor the sacred.

Brothers and sisters, we should honor the Crow. They were deeply spiritual people and they were at peace with themselves.

I say “thank you.”

The second time that they say what they have to say, they are more excited. The third time their song is song of happiness, they sing it only as a group. The leader only needs to remind them twice of what happy life is. The people know that also in their hearts.

But sometimes, as the singer on the fourth verse reminds us, we have to keep telling people that life is ok. He reconfirms and shows us again that we are a people and that he loves us.

The people respond with more excitement and they sing at their best then. They are a group and they are wise together. They speak in unison, and honor every man in their tribes.

Then, it stops. They stop together in unison and they honor their tribe.

When we stop, I hope every man and woman will honor his tribe, be him Lakota, Swedish, Japanese, or Iraqi.

Every man knows peace; some just don’t choose it as their way. May they learn more about the world, someday.

I want to offer you this song. I will be happy to get it to you, if you too want to hear this song. I can send it to you, by mail or by email. Which ever is best, I don't mind. I think first of my people.

I am Wyawaqacumen,
The bearman,
Born to the salmon people and the raven.
Son of all men.

That is why I am called “Walking Everywhere.”

I hope I have honored your fire.

I will bring more tobacco next time. We should smoke our pipes more often, even if white doctors tell us we shouldn't.

We were wiser then. We spoke "injun." Damn the white man for doing what he's done.

I do not forgive those men.

They took away my people and I am not Lenape, I am Swedish.

Sometimes, even the native Americans can benefit from Viking thoughts.

We are the same.
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Old 01-24-2007, 12:46 AM   #7
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"Respect the ground, respect the drum, respect each other."

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Old 01-24-2007, 02:05 AM   #8
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We smoke well together brother.

Let's add some other herbs, and make this pipe fun!

So says the "Walking Everywhere part that went to "oh my, we did something I probably shouldn't have... I still learn."

Tell me what I shouldn't do, always. I've done too many stupid things in my life not to claim that I'm a bearman...

lol!

or a shaman!

Bless you my brother!

Walk well.

With my deepest love for you,

I am sincerely

Wyawaqacumen,
Too much bear,
and not enough old lesson.

I mean to fix that.

Teach me. I too am a wise man.





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Old 01-24-2007, 02:54 AM   #9
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you are wierd.
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Old 01-24-2007, 02:56 AM   #10
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Old 01-24-2007, 08:52 AM   #11
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Wow.
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Old 01-24-2007, 09:51 AM   #12
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weirdness

Yes,

You are right. I am weird.

Welcome to my world. Let's learn together why I am.

And let's be friends. Weird people sometimes too have things that are worthwhile to say.

Wyawaqacumen

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Originally Posted by anishinabealltheway View Post
you are wierd.
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Old 01-24-2007, 09:55 AM   #13
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Cans of worms being opened

I hope you find that no worms in my can are not true.

If you do though, please tell me.

Don't worry, I'm a man that can take that also. I actually want your advice...

Thanks!

Wyawaqacumen

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Old 01-24-2007, 10:08 AM   #14
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I think we all felt you were genuinely interested in what these songs mean and where they came from; not some new age interpretation of what you think they mean. No offense, but what they mean to you is of no consequence whatsoever. It's what they mean to the original composers and their tribal communities that really matters.

Historian took some time typing out some translations there from various sioux songs in the hopes of helping you understand the difference between various song types. Personally, I think you owe him an apology because you weren't interested in that in the first place.

Things like this make more and more people less interested in helping people. It's understandable, but very sad at the same time. Man, how things have changed.
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Old 01-24-2007, 10:53 AM   #15
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Dear Wojapi and Historian,

You pointed out a mistake I made. I am sorry if I have offended either of you.

I think that you should understand though that I did not mean to ignore his point. I simply heard something else in his words.

Thank you though also for your correction.

I understand what you mean as well when you say that the only true meaning stems from the initial meaning, as meant by the writers of the song. This is your way of studying your history and I certainly will try to honor that.

I do believe however that there are things that I and others also have to say about the song that might make us all better off. I do not believe that culture is a stagnant thing after all my friend. We all continue to grow, as do these songs. They are not dead, neither are the people that wrote them. They remind us of that each day we sing their songs.

Again, excuse me for any misunderstanding, or ignorance in not understanding you and your ways.

I am still learning.

Wyawaqacumen
The bearman

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wojapi4Me View Post
I think we all felt you were genuinely interested in what these songs mean and where they came from; not some new age interpretation of what you think they mean. No offense, but what they mean to you is of no consequence whatsoever. It's what they mean to the original composers and their tribal communities that really matters.

Historian took some time typing out some translations there from various sioux songs in the hopes of helping you understand the difference between various song types. Personally, I think you owe him an apology because you weren't interested in that in the first place.

Things like this make more and more people less interested in helping people. It's understandable, but very sad at the same time. Man, how things have changed.
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Old 02-05-2007, 03:42 PM   #16
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We smoke well together brother.

Let's add some other herbs, and make this pipe fun!


.........or a shaman!.........

Teach me. I too am a wise man.



OOOOOOOH!

I wanna smoke what you're smokin' so I can be a shameman too!
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Old 02-05-2007, 04:09 PM   #17
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well....... what can I say, I think that Historian was very kind to take the time and translate some song bits for you. I feel embarrased for you.
I will tell you I do not speak fluent Ojibwe by any means, an I really do not dance anymore but I do feel from our songs, the emotions that a good singer can convey. these songs are playing in my house a lot of the times, specialy on road trips. I just feel like you posting what you say is your version, well that is just about as disrespectful as any other action you could have done. You are the reason why so many roll their eyes and ignore whites that come on here asking questions, you are the reason why this dang topic comes up so often. please just be gone and take your blasphomy with you. (okay i have no idea how to spell that.)
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Old 02-05-2007, 07:38 PM   #18
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I agree with migiziwoman. There is a time to talk and a time to listen. It seems like you're only interested in the talking part

PS. I don't know what your smokin in that pipe, but I think it's a good idea to quit.
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Old 02-05-2007, 08:25 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anishinabealltheway View Post
I agree with migiziwoman. There is a time to talk and a time to listen. It seems like you're only interested in the talking part

PS. I don't know what your smokin in that pipe, but I think it's a good idea to quit.
Yeah, Wyawaqacumens a tool.. Not even that BC pejin could do that much damage though......

Historian-check yer PMz, ok?
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Old 02-05-2007, 08:52 PM   #20
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TKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond reputeTKMJ Productions has a reputation beyond repute
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To Historian

Thankyou for taking the time to key out the song words and their translations. Being in the native music business and knowing little of a lot of different lanugages, It gets very confusing when finding proper translations.

When music is recorded for the arcives or a production CD, the words must be correct to keep the original intent intact. I come across so many drums who mess up the words to songs. It gets really bad sometimes. There are also a lot of drums who do not know the meaning of what they are singing. I for one would like to know the meaning behind every song I sing when I sit at the drum.

I try do always do things in a good way.

Thankyou for taking the time.

Ken
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