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Old 03-03-2004, 11:06 AM   #61
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I haven't seen the movie yet. Theatres are too packed!! But I have a question.....this movie is obviously going to make millions....so what do you think Mel should do with the money?? I've heard people say the only thing to do is donate it all to charity because he is just making money off the suffering of Christ. What do you all think?
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Old 03-03-2004, 11:23 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally posted by ogapahndn
I haven't seen the movie yet. Theatres are too packed!! But I have a question.....this movie is obviously going to make millions....so what do you think Mel should do with the money?? I've heard people say the only thing to do is donate it all to charity because he is just making money off the suffering of Christ. What do you all think?
I think Mel's gonna buy himself a nice big house and a great big car and put his feet up and just enjoy the fruits of his labor.

He paid to have it made - he gets the money. Yeah it'd be nice if he made some philanthropic gifts - but in reality he isn't obligated.

Oh and the church keeps most of their money and they get it all because of the suffering of Christ.
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Old 03-03-2004, 11:42 AM   #63
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This is from an newspaper article:

"..Gibson's church, which will not be open to the public, is reportedly also a traditionalist Catholic house of worship. (It is not affiliated with the archdiocese of Los Angeles.) According to tax and other public documents, Mel Gibson is president and chief executive officer of the nonprofit foundation that funds the church, and he is the foundation's sole contributor.


So I'm assuming some of the money he made from the movie will go back that church.
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Old 03-03-2004, 01:49 PM   #64
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got no interest in seeing some dude hung on a few pieces of wood and seeing his family cry around for him.
my hard earned money aint going toward some white man that is sitting at home and reclining in his seat and saying suuuckers they will watch anything that has jessus in it even though they all know the story.
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Old 03-03-2004, 02:07 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally posted by peekaboo
got no interest in seeing some dude hung on a few pieces of wood and seeing his family cry around for him.
my hard earned money aint going toward some white man that is sitting at home and reclining in his seat and saying suuuckers they will watch anything that has jessus in it even though they all know the story.
You know you bring up a good point about Mel. I think that he does want to get the message out, but come on now how many people are out there who don't really already know the story! I just don't want to go see a movie that I already know the ending and that will make me feel sad and bad and all. Movies are supposed to be entertainment, religion isn't!
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Old 03-03-2004, 03:36 PM   #66
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:Cry ....I felt sick to my stomach watching it...literally! I had to leave the theatuh. Just hearing him getting beat and all the crying was just too much....too sad...the part where Mary runs to his aid got me in total tears.....:Cry.... I think this movie is really no different in the "truth-be-told" movies, such as the ones depicting the Indian Wars, or the concentration camps for the Jews, or Pearl Harbor, etc.,. when realism is thrown on the big-screen and it hits our hearts and souls, how can one not be moved to tears or a knot in the throat.....:Cry.

My son (12) wants to see it, but I just don't know....I'll probably let him see it, afterall, would I be a hypocrit if I didn't let him see it and yet, allow him to watch all the other graphic horror and shoot-em-up movies out there....:good&evil .
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Old 03-03-2004, 08:21 PM   #67
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dang i wanna go see it :Cry
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Old 03-04-2004, 09:28 AM   #68
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Yeah I thought the movie was OK. I cried once but it was becuase my mom kicked over my jumbo pop cup that was holding the whiskey I smuggled in.

I mean, had it been based on a true story, I may have felt pangs of sorrow, but alas, it is simply one more eblellishment from the Fairy Tale commonly known as the Bible.

The movie didn't make the Jews look bad. Jews make the Jews look bad. I mean, they sent the son of God, the Light, the Savior, the Messiah to die right?
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Old 03-04-2004, 12:16 PM   #69
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Haven't seen it yet. I've already read the book.

I wonder what the reaction would be if a movie called, "The Passion of Mohammed" were to be released.
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Old 03-04-2004, 12:46 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jibby
Yeah I thought the movie was OK. I cried once but it was becuase my mom kicked over my jumbo pop cup that was holding the whiskey I smuggled in.

I mean, had it been based on a true story, I may have felt pangs of sorrow, but alas, it is simply one more eblellishment from the Fairy Tale commonly known as the Bible.

The movie didn't make the Jews look bad. Jews make the Jews look bad. I mean, they sent the son of God, the Light, the Savior, the Messiah to die right?

Gives Jibby the old school catholic nun twisted mouth stare. Dang, she stuck her tongue out at me.

Switches to Down South Black Mama with my hand on my big hip, Chile' you ain' right!!!!!
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Old 03-04-2004, 01:03 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally posted by Homalosa
Gives Jibby the old school catholic nun twisted mouth stare. Dang, she stuck her tongue out at me.

Switches to Down South Black Mama with my hand on my big hip, Chile' you ain' right!!!!!
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Old 03-04-2004, 01:36 PM   #72
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Jibs, the Bible isn't any more fairy tale than Native traditional beliefs. Besides which, there is ample archeological evidence uncovered over the years to support the existance of the peoples and places mentioned in both Old Testament and New Testament. King David's name was found on cuneiform tablets unearthed in what was Phoneicia-home of the Phillistines, now modern-day Lebanon. The writings of Tacitus, Roman historian of the 1st Century AD as well as Josephus, Jewish historian of the same period attest to the existance of Jesus, the Apostles and other disciples of Christ, the Jewish religious leaders, and the Roman and Hellenic persons and authorities such as Pontius Pilate, King Agrippa and Queen Bernice, and King Herod. There are also various documents of Roman officials surviving from that time which corraborate Tacitus' and Josephus' reports. Incidentally, Josephus interviewed several of the Apostles, including Peter and Paul, as well as the disciple Luke, who wrote the Gospel of Luke. Luke and Peter knew Jesus personally, and Paul met Him in His resurrected form.

About 4 months ago, the ossifer of Caiphas, the High Priest and head of the Sanhedrin, was discovered in Jerusalem. It validates his existence in a physical way, and suports the written documents.

The OT or Torah, which are the Pentatuch, or the 5 Books of Moses, and the Tanakh, the books of the Prophets and the Chronicles of the Kings, were passed down ver batim in written form in Hebrew for centuries because the Jews so revered the Word of God that they would not alter it a single bit, and to do so was to bring a death sentence not only upon oneself but also one's entire family-not even your pregnant wife or tiny baby would have been spared. So the messainic prophecies of Isaiah and Zacheriah, as well as the other prophets, were not altered to fit Jesus' life as some claim. His life fulfilled those prophecies, right down to being rejected and put to death by His own people at the hands of gentiles(Romans), in a form of execution which was totally unknown to Jews 500 years before Christ was born- crucifixion, referred to by Isaiah as being "hung on a tree".

There is an Orthodox Rabbi I know who said that, after reading the Old Testament of the New International Version of the Bible, he can see that about 95-97% of it is accurate, and says that the concepts not translatable account for that difference. Anytime you translate from one language to another, there are words, phrases, and concepts which will not translate or translate well.
Many American Jews do not speak Hebrew, and so read the Torah in English. Rabbi Rueben, like most orthodox and ultra-orthodox Jews, speaks and reads in Hebrew, and performs all Jewish ceremonies in Hebrew only. They do not speak English in their home, either.

Probably the reason Rabbi Rueben will talk to me about this stuff is that Jews consider Native Americans to be their brothers, since we alone of all the other peoples on the earth truly understand what suffering through centuries of genocide is like. Also because we have a deep and genuine veneration of The Almighty which is lacking in mainstream culture. Arnie and Yonit Kline, 2 Israeli Jews who are also friends, said also that Jews feel admiration for us because we, too, have fought and struggled to keep our cultures intact despite the crushing might of conquerors who have engaged in every means at their disposal to destroy our cultures and strip us of our identities to make us over in their image.

Where The Klines and Rabbi Rueben part company is that the Klines are Messianic Jews, Jews who have embraced Y'shua(Jesus is the Greek form of this name) as Messiah. Other Jews maintain that Messiah has not come, and say that Y'shua could not have been the Messiah because He did not come as a conquering king to destroy all of Israel's enemies and restore Israel to the glory it had under David and Solomon. They tend to ignore that Jesus correctly predicted the destruction of Jerusalem, in which He said that not one stone would be left on top of another, which was also prophesized by Isaiah centuries before. In 70 AD, following a Jewish revolt, Roman armies completely razed Jerusalem, destroying every single building, salting down the soil, and scattering the surviving population. Laws were passed which prohibited Jews from living with a league of where Jerusalem had stood on pain of death and were enforced until the fall of the Roman empire.

In Jewish culture you can be an atheist, a Buddhist, or anything else and still be Jewish. If, however, you believe in Y'shua as the Messiah, you are considered to be no longer a Jew. According to both Jewish and Messianic Jewish sources, this doctrine began in the 1st Century AD, so the church's anti-semetic views and actions beginning in the 4th Century AD did not prompt this. Jews in general do NOT debate the existence of Jesus, but the orthodox view is that He was a blasphemer who claimed to be the Son of God, and was put to death for that claim. the Roman records say He was executed for sedition.

Like I said previously, don't criticize the Bible if you haven't read it, just as no one should ever criticize someone else's beliefs without first studying them and really understanding them. Personally, I in no way equate faith in Christ with white people's church. Churchianity, as I call it, is attempting to glorify the mainstream culture as worship of God, and is antithical to the message of the Scriptures, which is the transformation of the culture through the worship of God. The message of God down through the ages has always been one of restoration and healing through a personal relationship with Him, of repenting and turning away from behaviors and other things which are contrary to His commandments or which turn our focus from Him to other things, and of reaching out to one's neighbor in love.

The message of the Gospels, and what Gibson says he tried to do in the movie, is to show us the lengths to which God would go to prove His love for us, by making the Word of His Mouth become a man who was both God and man at the same time, who felt all the same things we do, and who suffered not only the torture of the flesh but the moments of total seperation from the Creator as all of the world's sins were laid upon Him and God had to turn away because He cannot abide sin in His presence, all to redeem our sorry selves from the spiritual death and seperation from Him brought about by our sins. He reached down to us because we could not reach up to Him.
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Old 03-04-2004, 01:59 PM   #73
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Let me clarify...

I HAVE read the Bible. Too many times. I am not contesting the fact that the characters did live at one point in time. I am saying that their purpose has been embellished to the point of turning fact to fiction.

I understand about translating a book from one language to another, the initial sentiment is usually lost in some way. But I have SEEN (yes with my two own bulgy eyes) two bibles that had discrepensies.

I don't believethat Jesus died on the cross. I don't believe a Father would do that to a Son. I believed he lived and died as a very pious man. Thats it thats all.
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Old 03-04-2004, 02:05 PM   #74
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Um, the bible was written by a bunch of men--you know, a re-count of history adding in a little fantasy.

And...do you think today, we would believe a person that said that were told to write this story by god? Yeah, I know they instutionalize people for that.

Quote:
Probably the reason Rabbi Rueben will talk to me about this stuff is that Jews consider Native Americans to be their brothers, since we alone of all the other peoples on the earth truly understand what suffering through centuries of genocide is like.
Oh my, that Rabbi is completely delusional. OMG, he has no clue what's going on in the world, let alone the past of other countries AND the genocide that Jews have caused too. No group is special on that part. Some one has tried to eliminate one group one way or another. ....uh, brothers....whatever
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Old 03-04-2004, 02:11 PM   #75
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Look people are entitled to express what they believe whether you agree with it or not - and you mustn't assume that everyone believes or follows the ways of the bible, church or jesus. If you are devoted to christianity - great - whatever gets you through the day!:Angel2 Just know that not everyone follows your path.

Jibby's not the only tradish on this board - I too follow a traditional path - though in my case I left the church many years ago.

I didn't sign on to this board to have any one try to provide me with bible study classes - had enough as a kid thanks!

So stop telling jibby she's wrong or a heathen or anything like that - she is free to believe what she chooses - as am I and as are you! Respect goes 2 ways - so if you expect it - you gotta give it.

I think I'll just go watch Starsky and Hutch!
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Old 03-04-2004, 02:22 PM   #76
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Dang, preach on!
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Old 03-04-2004, 02:35 PM   #77
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I don't like this back and forth pitting one belief against another. Jibby's my girl and although we believe differently, I think she knows I was playing. Still, all words fall on deaf ears when folks feel preached at or attacked for being Traditional or Christian. I believe the God I serve needs no defense, rather He is my defense. It's not my purpose or job to evangelize through criticism. If people come to know Jesus through me then it will be how I represent Him in my daily walk.

So can everyone please pull back and treat each other respectfully? The purpose of the thread was to get people's opinions of the film, not pick corners and come out swinging.

Rodney King said one thing that made sense:
"Can't we all just get along?"
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Old 03-04-2004, 02:42 PM   #78
is hot like frybread!!
 
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I liked the movie, however i am not catholic therefore skepitical about the scene which depicts the shroud of turin.

I was deeply moved and felt that this film was not in it for the money but instead for the retelling of the story of Christ's passion.

as much as i want to write more my personal critique, i can't at the moment, but will be back soon to do so!!!
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Old 03-04-2004, 03:11 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally posted by Singing Eagle

I think I'll just go watch Starsky and Hutch!
Yes!Comes out tomorrow!!
Now that's one movie I really want to see!!

I'm not one for watching or hearing people in pain and misery it smears my non water proof eye liner and me no likey that!!
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Old 03-04-2004, 04:15 PM   #80
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"Like I said previously, don't criticize the Bible if you haven't read it, just as no one should ever criticize someone else's beliefs without first studying them and really understanding them."

ok well, uhm, this statement in and of itself without the rest of the uhm, interesting, essay you wrote to accompany it, is a little well critical. Why? Simply because you chose to use the word Don't. I honestly wouldn't reccomend that if you are going to suggest that someone not criticize other people's beliefs you shouldn't start out and finish up w/ a defense of your own. I really think that if you took your own advice we wouldn't have to sit through the Biblical history lesson you provided, and that you wouldn't have told Jibby Don't. Jibby can say whatever Jibby wants to say and can criticize whatever Jibby wants to criticize!

"I believe the God I serve needs no defense, rather He is my defense."
Well put! We do not need to sit around and argue about who God is and What the Bible is and isn't. One entry on one thread is not going to change the way a person believes.

Here is something I have learned in my walk w/ God and I will pass along to you now, you can take it or leave it, I just know it has helped me live a better, happier life.

Look for the goodness and truth in others and you will find it. If you are looking for the incorrectness or evil in someone it will find you!

Relax, aren't Christians alway's saying God is in Control, so let it go and let God deal with it. I think I said earlier, not one religion has a copyright on God. We weren't created to know everything so it might help if we quit acting like we do, it stunts your growth.
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