Public Anouncement: The Gloves Are Off

[OneidaDreamer]

I don't friggn write all "Native" themed poetry. I never have.

That's another gripe I have with skins and or skins stereotypes. Why do people feel compelled to write about just Native subject matter? I mean, feel it and write it. I guess. But don't pose. I can tell the tried too hard stuff from the real felt stuff. Damn! Just gets on my nerves is all. I never understood limiting myself to one type of style or genre or what have you.

I have read some really dope kick a$$ "Native" themed work. But I've read some real crap too. Yes I am being harsh. But I would expect no less from my peers in the writing/literature game. I have refrained from telling some folks on here that I think that their stuff isn't to my liking one bit. Out of respect; and when I first started posting on here; NO ONE knew who I was. I had no clout. I will however use constructive criticism and not attack anyone. That is below me and without honor.

But now the gloves are off.

[Dat1NdnGuy]

Ummm ok?

[NorthofAda]

You gotta write what you know - that's the rule of thumb for creative writing that I was taught. As a non-rez native reclaiming her heritage, it would be foolish for me to write from a perspective of someone who grew up in Chickasaw territory, lived traditional, spoke the language, etc., because that's not me. I wouldn't presume to understand what it's like to experience full-contact, anti-Indian bigotry, because I never experienced it growing. The worst thing I remember was being called "chicken s*&t" and "Chicken of the Sea" by my classmates, who didn't know what a Chickasaw was.

Most of us on this forum are native, and could write about some aspect of that identity, be it powwowing, stories of our ancestors, etc., but we're all other things, too. Some are parents. Some are teenagers. Some live in urban/suburban environments with their own problems and stereotypes. Natives on the rez deal with other issues that I wouldn't dare "pretend" to have experienced for creative writing's sake as I have too much respect for those who have faced challenges that I have never had to face myself.

You're a gifted writer, OneidaDreamer, and I've ready many of your pieces, both poetry and essay. You write what you know and what you feel, and if I had constructive criticism to offer I would most certainly offer it as I have much respect for you. Not everybody would have the guts to put their feelings out there for others to read/criticize/judge.

I've only put one piece out there, a poem...

http://www.powwows.com/gathering/showthread.php?t=38017

Never heard back on it, so I don't know if:

a. Nobody read it.
b. People read it and thought it was crap.
C. People read it and thought it was okay, but didn't take the time to respond.

I guess it kind of bothered me not to get any feedback on it, but at the same time, there is something liberating about putting one's strong feelings into words, a kind of unburdening of oneself, I suppose.

I hope you keep writing and sharing with us...native-themed or otherwise...because despite the many differences among us, some of which comes out rather vocally in some threads here, we of native descent/heritage/tribal membership need to stick together. It's a big, bad world out there, and we need to have each others' backs.

Just my 0.02...

[Dat1NdnGuy]

I just live on the premisr of "write and let write" I can't presume to tell anyone how or where their writing comes from. Its all really subjective anyhooz. I know people who HATE writers I think are genius'.

[OneidaDreamer]

All Apologies

Constructive criticism is the key. I'm not about to tell someone that their stuff is total crap. North of Ada is right in saying that poetry/writing is very subjective. But I'm still going to be honest and offer my 2 cents on some stuff. Some things need revision or to be fleshed out some more.

When people get to college and take higher level writng/lit/english courses they will get the same treatment by their peers and professors. In fact they should expect it.

I didn't mean to come off like an arrogant jerk with my first post. I was in a crabby salty mood this morning, and I didn't meant to take it out on my fellow writers/poets. I have seemed to forget that we writers are all at different stages in our lives and our writing endeavers/careers. So I wish to recind my former comments on that first post of mine.

I apologize to my fellow writers/poets for behaving like a complete nazi jerk. Who am I to tell someone else their labor of love sucks? Whether it does or not is not the point. I was in the wrong by making those comments.


Peace

[trob226]

I've only put one piece out there, a poem...

http://www.powwows.com/gathering/showthread.php?t=38017

Never heard back on it, so I don't know if:

a. Nobody read it.
b. People read it and thought it was crap.
C. People read it and thought it was okay, but didn't take the time to respond.

I guess it kind of bothered me not to get any feedback on it, but at the same time, there is something liberating about putting one's strong feelings into words, a kind of unburdening of oneself, I suppose.
...

I did read it, NOAda, and I've read it again now. I like it. Actually, when I read it before, it was hitting a little too close to home for me to comment. It's not crap. It's not Tennyson, but then neither am I so I can't offer any constructive criticism that would make it better. It conveys what you were feeling, and I was feeling pretty much the same when I first read it. Don't stop writing.

[NorthofAda]

I did read it, NOAda, and I've read it again now. I like it. Actually, when I read it before, it was hitting a little too close to home for me to comment. It's not crap. It's not Tennyson, but then neither am I so I can't offer any constructive criticism that would make it better. It conveys what you were feeling, and I was feeling pretty much the same when I first read it. Don't stop writing.

Thanks, trob. Sorry to hear that you have been feeling sad as I have lately...

I didn't mean to come across like I was fishing for compliments - my point was just that even if you write something, and no one reads it or they read and don't agree, it can be kind of a catharsis just to put words to those feelings. Sometimes I'm sad, or angry, and it may seem like I can't find a really good reason for it, but then when I try to write about it, it helps me understand my feelings a little better. I used to write a lot more when I was younger, now it's harder to put my thoughts into words with so many distractions in the day-to-day life, ya know? Anyway, thanks for the feedback.

Oneida - I didn't think you sounded like a Nazi - keep those words flowin' - eh?

[Dweick]

Thanks, trob. Sorry to hear that you have been feeling sad as I have lately...

I didn't mean to come across like I was fishing for compliments - my point was just that even if you write something, and no one reads it or they read and don't agree, it can be kind of a catharsis just to put words to those feelings. Sometimes I'm sad, or angry, and it may seem like I can't find a really good reason for it, but then when I try to write about it, it helps me understand my feelings a little better. I used to write a lot more when I was younger, now it's harder to put my thoughts into words with so many distractions in the day-to-day life, ya know? Anyway, thanks for the feedback.

Oneida - I didn't think you sounded like a Nazi - keep those words flowin' - eh?

I know I am guilty of reading posts and not commenting (For that I am sorry)
Sometimes words are just not needed. or we don't exactly know what to say.
I loved to write as a child it was easier to put words on paper than to speak from within.
I got in trouble from my adoptive family on a short story I wrote about how I felt inside big conference,with principal,teacher ETc
It shocked them to read about my life in foster care Big Drama and then for years that dear mother of mine would search anything I wrote on anything to make sure I was keeping things happy pink and puffy.
It held me back a long time from really being able to express myself in words and paper.

but don't ever be afraid and close your thoughts in for fear of it not being right or wrong or loved. ( I did it for years I still do but thats another can of worms for the next sub forum on counseling our issues thread)
I bet every piece of creative writing will touch at least someone .thats what you want to do is touch with someone you might be surprised that many pieces of writing here do touch inside peoples hearts and minds
But it would be easier for the writer to know yea or nay on their piece of work.

My thoughts and heart goes out to anybody putting their work on line for us to enjoy and read and think about you have courage more than than me and probably some others as well

[indian-heart-beat]

Constructive criticism is the key. I'm not about to tell someone that their stuff is total crap. North of Ada is right in saying that poetry/writing is very subjective. But I'm still going to be honest and offer my 2 cents on some stuff. Some things need revision or to be fleshed out some more.

When people get to college and take higher level writng/lit/english courses they will get the same treatment by their peers and professors. In fact they should expect it.

I didn't mean to come off like an arrogant jerk with my first post. I was in a crabby salty mood this morning, and I didn't meant to take it out on my fellow writers/poets. I have seemed to forget that we writers are all at different stages in our lives and our writing endeavers/careers. So I wish to recind my former comments on that first post of mine.

I apologize to my fellow writers/poets for behaving like a complete nazi jerk. Who am I to tell someone else their labor of love sucks? Whether it does or not is not the point. I was in the wrong by making those comments.

Peace

Hey hey hey, don't try to do my job lol. It's enough when one of us is called a Nazi whatever, o.k.?

To me>>>>
poets are very special people, they offer their thoughts and heart, soul, feelings, dreams and put them into wonderful or not so wonderful words- whatever fits best at that moment.

One of such great personalities- he calls me daughter- never came back again, because he felt 'not loved' in this forum. He is an elder and felt ignored and frustrated somehow. He wanted to express what's in his heart and mind, what for him is very important...
He never came back. He was very very ill at that time, it was a cry for help somehow.
The other person - he calls me his wife forever and a day- is
my Ex. I will honor his poems forever and a day. He often lied at me, his poems never did. I will love the poet forever, not the criminal man.

Oneida Dreamer, English is not my language, I am German, am I welcome to say my opinion?

To me
constructive critics are good, can hurt though. It is like being judged about whether feelings are right or wrong, it is in the eye of the beholder. And sometimes I just need to read a poem while I am in a different mood. Makes me think different and feel different. Depends on how much I let in and what I let in. It's like allergy or medicine lol. Even political poems cause feelings. Poems are causing feelings and thoughts. They are causing something.
My opinion: Just be careful when you leave a constructive comment on a poem without having been asked for your opinion. Even structure can be important and make more sense when it seems to be 'wrong'. My 2 €urocents as a German-non-poet.

Have a great, never ever dare to stop writing, o.k.?