Attorneys Join Tuscarora Case

[Privateer6]

By Margaret J. Stair Wilson Daily Times Staff Writer Saturday March 12

ELM CITY- The Skaroreh-Katenuaka at Contentnea Creek Indians have enlisted two well-known Indian-activist lawyers in their effort to gain recognition as a tribe by the federal government.

Tribal recognition would give them rights as a sovereign people. The petition, filed by members of the tribe in JUly 2003, asks for the return of all ancestral remains and more than 9,000 acres of land set aside for the Tuscaroras in the 1930s.

"We're going to enter the case as attorneys," said Barry Nakell of Chapel Hill, referring to himself and Michael Swinwood, a Canadian attorney who specializes in native sovereignty issues.

They are working on drafting amended pleadings to add to the case, which challenges the Lumbee Act of 1956.

That act defines all Indians who live in Robeson and its neighboring counties to be Lumbees. About 6,000 of the Indians there identify themselves as Tuscaroras.

To get out from under the restrictions of the LUmbee Act, a group of Tuscaroras have begun establishing a base on Four Tenths Road near Elm City. Before the coming of European settlers, Tuscaroras lived in the area.

Green county is the site of the last battle in the Tuscarora War, where 950 Tuscaroras were killed in 1713. Afterwards, the northern faction of the Tuscaroras conceded defeat and were relocated to upstate New York. The southern faction hid out in the swamps of Robeson County, according to tribe members.

"We've always maintained our culture, language, and history," said Timothy Jacobs, a spokesman for the Elm City [group]

In the 1930s, using a method that is no longer accepted as valid by anthropologists, the Bureau of Indian Affairs identified 22 individuals as being Tuscarora. The 1930 Census had recorded 12,000 Tuscaroras in Robeson County alone, but only 239 were tested to see if they were Tuscarora.

THe 22 were given the right to organize as a tribe, and the federal government bought 9,333 acres to create a reservation for them. But they never got control of the land, said Chris Hardison, who wrote and filed the initial case. The government has used the Lumbee Act to justify withholding recognition of Tuscarora soveregnty.

"Our main contention is the fact that the state has continued to try to cover up the people's identity," Hardison said. " History has been revised for people here, and we feel that that's cultural genocide."

Although Hardison questions the methods used in identifying the 22, they did result in recognition that some Tuscaroras did live in eastern North Carolina.

"We are contesting the very validity and basis of those tests done in the first place," he said. "But no matter how ludicrous, nevertheless they were 22 people recognized. They have the right to come together, get land, and decide who should be included in the tribe."

He believes the government fears that, given tribal status, the Tuscaroras will claim too much land.

"Many people here in Wilson County didn't receive deeds to land until the mid-or late-1700s," said Jacobs. "Who gave these people the right to say they were landowners? Lords appointed by the king distributed the land. My people certainly did not sign the title."

[Blackbear]

this should be interesting

[Privateer6]

this should be interesting

I edited the opriginal post to include the entire article.
GJJudd

[Blackbear]

Thanks GJJudd

"We've always maintained our culture, language, and history," said Timothy Jacobs, a spokesman for the Elm City [group]

No they did not!!!! They came to NY looking for answers time and again, they've learned the language from OUR speakers' recordings and teachings, books and whatnot, and they lost all form of the culture so they have been having Mohawk guys teach them fundamentalist longhouse ways which is'nt even our original religion and is'nt the longhouse that we in NY follow today!

"Many people here in Wilson County didn't receive deeds to land until the mid-or late-1700s," said Jacobs. "Who gave these people the right to say they were landowners? Lords appointed by the king distributed the land. My people certainly did not sign the title."

Indians in those times were not given land titles period. The reason that there are people with titles in the first place back then was because they were WHITE men who married TUSCARORA women. Or indian women for that matter. North Carolina's history with indians is all crappy, why the heck do you think us Tuscaroras left in the first place?

I don't think their case holds water and the lawyers are in it for the money and recognition, but if they do indeed have a case this like I said should be quite interesting to see develope.

[Privateer6]

Since I may have alot of free time on my hands, I may have to do some serious research on the matter. I have a 2 volume set on the Tuscarora in my possession. While the artwork is horrible, it uses good primary sources. An added bonus is that the copy is a "review copy," and I have some of the notes by the reviewer. Just from the set, some light reading on the Iroquois, and a few emails and PMs from a recognized Tuscarora (Black Bear). From everything I gathered, they don't stand a chance because Blount's half of the Tuscarora Nation, the ones that remained neutral in the Tuscarora War, eventually joined the rest of the Tuscarora Nation in New York inthe 1760s.
GJJudd

[Blackbear]

I have heard it told that those that stayed were assimilated into other tribes such as the Occaneechi. They did alot of trading with us so that only makes sense. I believe it was Blount that remained neutral though. It was Chief Hancock that started the war and the others did'nt come to support the retaliation but later joined us on the migration because of the continueing capture of our people who were sold as slaves to finance the settlers side of the war.

[Blackbear]

Ok I got a question or two to ask the lumbee folks here. I was told recently that you guys were mentioned in Lawson's diariees, and I kinda recall that even though the name Lumbee of course is'nt used, but you guys were thought to be lost colony "Croaton"... so I guess my first question is, why is that you guys can't show historical standing then for the normal bia process of getting recognition? (just curious)

and the second is , how can these guys who are claiming tuscarora make this claim when at the time the tuscarora were still in NC as a whole at the same time, if they are all decended from folks who were enrolled lumbees?

[Badmutha]

I don't think their case holds water and the lawyers are in it for the money and recognition, but if they do indeed have a case this like I said should be quite interesting to see develope.

Hey Blackbear, if you want some irony, Barry Nakell, the lawyer who actually is challenging the 1956 Lumbee Act, represents Rebekah Revels. Now there wouldn't be a conflict of interest here now would there? But then again, Nakell isn't known for his ethics. He's been convicted of shoplifting for Pete's sake.

[MsLum91]

Your question about Croaton....

There is a place "CroatOAn" (the name that was carved in the tree at the Lost Colony site). There is no such tribe as Croatan (or Croaton, as I have seen it). Hamilton McMillan (white lawmaker / historian, & sponsor of the bill to establish the university, or Normal School as it was called) came up with that name and "Gave" it to the Indians here.

I don't doubt that some of the members of the lost colony found there way into the area and eventually married/or were adopted into the tribe. The comparison of the names on the colony roles and some of our common tribal names is too close not to have some connection, but we aren't the Lost Colony, we just happed to find part of it.

The way I understand it there were only a few (small few) families that stayed behind. We do have people here in this community that can credibly trace back to one or more of those families, but not nearly as many as some would like people to believe. Every year I see a handful of people that I grew up knowing to be Lumbee and all of a sudden they turn up to be Tuscarora. I never ceases to amaze me. I have seen siblings with the same parents and one claims Lumbee and the other claims Tuscarora.

Your're right Blackbear, this whole situation will be very interesting to watch.

[Blackbear]

Thanks for replying. I know there was not and never was a croatan indian tribe, but what I was getting at was that those were you guys right? Even though Lawson had his information wrong, he was still talking about the indians of robeson county right? Does'nt that show historical standing?

[lumbeedancer]

Thanks for replying. I know there was not and never was a croatan indian tribe, but what I was getting at was that those were you guys right? Even though Lawson had his information wrong, he was still talking about the indians of robeson county right? Does'nt that show historical standing?

I don't get on here very much any more, so sorry for not answering sooner.

But yes we can show historical standing, even the 1956 Lumbee Act (in its' opening sentance "Whereas many Indians now living in Robeson and adjoining counties are descendants of that once large and prosperous tribe which occupied the lands along the Lumbee River at the time of the earliest white settlements in that section) describes us as a tribe dating back to the time of first sustained white contact in our region.

Like Arlinda Locklear and Jack Campisi both said at the Washington DC hearing "Out of the seven BIA criteria for recognition, Lumbees meet all but one" that one being that we have been legislatively restricted from such a relationship. ie.

"Nothing in this Act shall make such Indians eligible for any services performed by the United States for Indians because of their status as Indians, and none of the statutes of the United States which affect Indians because of their status as Indians shall be applicable to the Lumbee Indians"

[lumbeedancer]

By Margaret J. Stair Wilson Daily Times Staff Writer Saturday March 12


In the 1930s, using a method that is no longer accepted as valid by anthropologists, the Bureau of Indian Affairs identified 22 individuals as being Tuscarora. The 1930 Census had recorded 12,000 Tuscaroras in Robeson County alone, but only 239 were tested to see if they were Tuscarora.

THe 22 were given the right to organize as a tribe, and the federal government bought 9,333 acres to create a reservation for them. But they never got control of the land, said Chris Hardison, who wrote and filed the initial case. The government has used the Lumbee Act to justify withholding recognition of Tuscarora soveregnty.

"

I know Tim fairly well but I haven't met this Chris fellow yet, I did manage to talk with his father the other day though. I have to say I respect them for standing up for what they believe, but at the same time I honestly feel they are fighting for a lost cause.

It is true that census records show about 12,000 Indians in Robeson County in the 30's, its also true that a handfull of them ended up being recognized by the BIA, the problem is that they were recognized as Siouan Indians (i.e an amalgimation of Cheraw, Keyauwee, Waccimaw, Cape Fears, remnants of Eno, and remnants of Shakori) not Tuscarora!

I don't understand how these guys can keep claiming that Lumbees are all Tuscaroras for several obviouse reasons.

First of all Robeson County is historic Siouan territory, Tuscaroras (who ar Iriquoian) did not live here, nor were they welcome plain and simple (as they were hereditary enemies of the Siouan speaking nations native to this area)!

Secondly, the records show the presence of wild untaimed siouan speaking tribes in the region where Robeson county is located at least until about 1739. Thats over twenty five years after these tribes helped the colonists break the Tuscarora in 1712! Basically, there is no way that any Tuscaroras would move here in their weakend state while their hereditary enemies were running aroung strong and free! It's just not plausible to me, sure a few of them married into this community years later (almost a hundred years later) but thats it!

Last of all I would love for them to explain to me why the members of the Red Mans Lodge Society (which existed between about 1910 and 1925) were all wearing siouan dress (pictures don't lie) or why the few traditional words that did survive here (which were recorded in the 30s) were also, you guessed it, "SIOUAN"!

[Blackbear]

I know Tim fairly well but I haven't met this Chris fellow yet, I did manage to talk with his father the other day though. I have to say I respect them for standing up for what they believe, but at the same time I honestly feel they are fighting for a lost cause.

It is true that census records show about 12,000 Indians in Robeson County in the 30's, its also true that a handfull of them ended up being recognized by the BIA, the problem is that they were recognized as Siouan Indians (i.e an amalgimation of Cheraw, Keyauwee, Waccimaw, Cape Fears, remnants of Eno, and remnants of Shakori) not Tuscarora!

Last of all I would love for them to explain to me why the members of the Red Mans Lodge Society (which existed between about 1910 and 1925) were all wearing siouan dress (pictures don't lie) or why the few traditional words that did survive here (which were recorded in the 30s) were also, you guessed it, "SIOUAN"!

Actually I read that document on the findings of the 22 and they were simply found to be indians, it was never stated what kind, but I have also seen a letter from some guy at the BIA that these guys contacted who said in the letter they were found to be tuscarora... now why he said that when the original person who did the reseach did not name tribes I don't know. But it was never said exactly from what tribes they were from.

[lumbeedancer]

Actually I read that document on the findings of the 22 and they were simply found to be indians, it was never stated what kind, but I have also seen a letter from some guy at the BIA that these guys contacted who said in the letter they were found to be tuscarora... now why he said that when the original person who did the reseach did not name tribes I don't know. But it was never said exactly from what tribes they were from.

The Seltzer report (documents on the 22) itself was merely dealing with blood quantum and what not, it is true that it did not deal with tribal/linguistic affiliation in itself, but in reference to the recognition of these persons the BIA refered to them as Siouans.

If you read the report given to the BIA by John Swanton (Leading expert on Southeastern indians of his time, employed by the Smithsonian Institutes bureau of ethnology and research, exactly the same sort of expert which would be used if Lumbees were to go through the current administrative process of today), you will see that the BIA very clearly accepted the fact that these were siouan people. They even went as far as "supporting" a congressional bill to recognize the whole body of 12,000+ people as "The Siouan Indians of the Lumber River" (without financial benefits of course).

In reference to some sort of Tuscarora reference by them (the BIA), I do know that there was a case involving a Maynor man (one of the 22) in which he supposedly claimed Tuscarora (so certain folks have told me, never seen it myself). What I find ironic about it though is that the man who handed down the siouan words was also a Maynor!

Honestly I don't know all the behind the scene things that took place or were said, but in my opinion whether this fellow claimed it or not, i seriously doubt he was actually recognized as Tuscarora!

[Roskerah]

Your question about Croaton....

There is a place "CroatOAn" (the name that was carved in the tree at the Lost Colony site). There is no such tribe as Croatan (or Croaton, as I have seen it). Hamilton McMillan (white lawmaker / historian, & sponsor of the bill to establish the university, or Normal School as it was called) came up with that name and "Gave" it to the Indians here.

I don't doubt that some of the members of the lost colony found there way into the area and eventually married/or were adopted into the tribe. The comparison of the names on the colony roles and some of our common tribal names is too close not to have some connection, but we aren't the Lost Colony, we just happed to find part of it.

The way I understand it there were only a few (small few) families that stayed behind. We do have people here in this community that can credibly trace back to one or more of those families, but not nearly as many as some would like people to believe. Every year I see a handful of people that I grew up knowing to be Lumbee and all of a sudden they turn up to be Tuscarora. I never ceases to amaze me. I have seen siblings with the same parents and one claims Lumbee and the other claims Tuscarora.

Your're right Blackbear, this whole situation will be very interesting to watch.

Chwe'n,
Man, isn't this an interesting thread. I didn't know which post to answer first, so I will start with this one I guess, and may be able to answer some others from above at the same time.

Becky, that first paragraph was pretty much dead on the money. The only thing I could add is what I said in a previous post, on another thread. Here it is:

http://www.powwows.com/gathering/showthread.php?t=30516

The conspiracy to cover up the people's name began in 1885 on February 10th by Hamilton McMillan. This is the day that the name Croatan was passed into law. Two days later, in the Fayetteville Observer, an article on the people here was reprinted from a Asheville newspaper weeks before. In it, it says..."They say that their traditions say that the people we call the Croatan Indians (though they do not recognize that name as that of a tribe, but only a village, and that they were Tuscaroras), were always friendly to the whites; and finding them destitute and despairing of ever receiving aid from England, persuaded them to leave the Island, and go to the mainland.…They gradually drifted away from their original seats, and at length settled in Robeson, about the center of the county.

Now, McMillan Knew what our people's oral traditions were weeks before the law was passed, yet he chose to pass the "FIRST" of many fictitious names that would follow. Look it up. Go to the library and get the Mircofilm for the Fayetteville observer for Feb 12, 1885, and see for yourself. Or go here: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NCTuscarora/ join, and you will see it all here.


Next, as far as seeing people who were once Lumbee, and now Tuscarora, this is probably because these people have found out the truth about who they really are.

Ooneh,
Chris