Immigration

[ndnmama]

Language

i forgot in my previous reply all the statements about Illegals not speaking english. Do you hear yourself when you ask that question? my grandfather was punished in boarding school for not speaking english. Many of my elders of my tribe do not speak english. So do you demand that they learn the english language or be forced to speak it? We was here first and maybe everyone should learn the native language from the region they live in.

[ndnmama]

The only race not an immigrate is Native!!!

Ok, firstly great to read all of the replies to the immigration story. I think that the new immigration laws are nothing more that a flashback to the discrimination that we as a people have dealt with in our past. We have a race of hard working people that are being denied the right to move to a country that they can provide for their families better. What does the Statue of Liberty have printed on the front of her statue at her feet? I will let you research that one. My father is Chicano and my mother is Native American. My grandparents were here illegally. They opened their own Mexican restaurant and became very successful. My father still has the business. He tried hiring "americans" but they didn't want to show up for work, didn't want to do the work for $6 or $7 an hour, and when he hired some family from mexico you don't hear complaint just that they are happy to be making more than $3 hour and happy to be providing for their family. We as natives should not be looking at our brown brothers with distent. They had their lands taken from them also (parts of Texas, New Mexico, and Arizona.) The reason we learn history is so that it will not repeat itself. But oh yeah we didn't learn indian history is school, we learned the white man history, they didn't do anything wrong to the indians. For a law abiding law enforcing country to be so high and mighty with sticking to the laws. What about our treaties? Are those lot legal binding documents signed by government officials? So we want to enforce laws when it benefits the white man? I haven't seen any Mexicans blow anything up, these are not the illegal immigrants we should be worried about. As far as taking food or benefits from the american citizens. There is more white trailer trash taking from the system then all Mexican illegal immigrates here today. Thank you

[Joe G]

It's also interesting that Mexico is very difficult to emigrate IN to....and has a very tight grip on it's southern border. Maybe the US should build a 'wall' yeah right, they'd probably hire illegal aliens to build it! I don't see congress doing very much about this anytime soon...since:
on the left side..it will increase the total number of votes, over time...and on the right side, there is cheap labor to be exploited...so it will be VERY hard to solve this problem.....and also to pay for it...since while we are allowing this increase, we are also at the very same time, determined to send most entry level, or manufacturing and labor jobs overseas!!!
very coherent policy? GREED....at it's finest.
It's hard to fault people who wish to gain a better life for themselves, and as stated, very nearly everyone except NDNS immigrated here (or, more correctly invaded) at one point in time or another...the question is HOW many can we support, and does the law apply? or if not, then why have it?
I think the super rich are nearly all 'globalists' and wish to control the $$ of the whole world..and aren't really all that concerned about national sovereignity.....since their real desire is a one world economy....where 5% have all the money....so they outsource most of the jobs which will be needed here by the other 95%....and remain willing to exploit any and all from anywhere.....

[windrider]

It is good to have debate on this issue.The reason I posted is because this issue affects ALL American citizens and Legal Immigrants.

It goes beyond tax laws.The following happened to some friends of mine and it happens every day.

You and your family are going to that pow-wow that you have been anticipating for weeks.As you tool down the highway in your faithful NDN ride with legal registration,liscense and insurance.Suddenly you are impacted by another vehicle.In this tragic accident 2 of your family members are killed and 3 are severly injured.You have miraculously not injured but are very shaken up .You see the other driver stumble out drunkenly swearing as beer and liquer bottles tumble from his vehicle.The police arrive and as it turns out the driver is drunk,has no liscense,no registration,no insurance and is in this country illegally...so what happens??? To him,nothing but a couple hot meals and a free ride back to the border.Your familys life has been turned upside down.You may or may not be able to collect on your insurance.How many laws were broken??? 1-vehicular homicide 2-no liscence 3-no registration 4-no insurance 5-DWI on top of the original illegal entry....but yet your family will bear the brunt of this nightmare.


Go to any other country and break a law and see what happens....you dont get deported...you get thrown in a dungeon with absolutely no rights!!!


A few months back a Truck driver here illegally from Bosnia killed 3 people and hurt several others in Dallas,Tx. All he got was a ticket back to Bosnia.

[seaotter]

Because there are so many hispanics in this the issue of race is being raised as the reason for the way they are treated. Raising the racist yell is an old tradition among minorities, everyone has done it sometime (even religious minorities).
NPR interviewed a group of people who had just been sworn in after going through legal immigration. And they (as a group) said to let these people in after breaking the law was a spit in the face of all their sacrifice, hard work and time.
It is NOT about RACE. It is about breaking the law and protecting against terrorists. It is a miracle that something hasn't happened yet, or they are waiting till they get enough people through. One can immigrate legally- so why do it the other way?
It is also about a solid, non changing law. It seems to be at the moment a law of convience, arbitrarily applied. The law needs to be made clear, the same for everyone and applied the same. While there are many laws I am unhappy with, even in our Traditional societies there are Laws (traditions) ect. People who break laws, then expect the equal treatment of those that don't are not going to be healthy for the future generations.
It's easy to make this about race. It unfortuantly is for some people. But by focusing on that we are missing the other points. It is not impossible to immigrate, get a work visa (half the Outer Banks buisnesses rely on foreign students in the summer) it can be done. Why break the law? Are you better than the law? Does it not apply to you? This is my sticking point. And like I said earlier my dad is a naturalized american. So I know it can be done.

[tainon8vgirl]

tau guaitaio/hello friends
yea i think they should just learn the language. my opinion is its kinda disrespectful to be in another land and have the arrogance to commute to people in your own language when the language spoken in that country is entirely different. I understand that many immigrants have left their country because of political injustice and such but to sneak into this country isn't right. there are plenty of other immigrants who are here for the same reasons as the illegal immigrants that came here legally....well just a thought...but i love everybody so lets just be friends...

[LILfawn]

If they are indigious peoples and not spanish decendents, are they really immigrants, once there were no borders for our people. As far as those who are not i think they should immigrate into america the legally and i wouldnt have a problems. As poor aas i am i dont think america could feed many more mouths with out more changes to our system, them maybe we could take on more immigrants. right now i dont think its a good time for illegal imigrants but legal ones ar ok

[billyjoejimbob]

SUPERNDNGRL-I think it was you who mentioned taxes.

Yeah they have a fake SSN, but they work "under the table" the govt isnt getting any income tax from them. No illegal has a legit, tax paying job.

and food isnt taxable.

if they do pay tax on purchases, since they are in poor areas they pay less. in NJ, tax is 3% in poor areas.

so the government is getting 3 cents per dollar spent on anything other than rent or food.

Im paying the govt 25% of my income, 6% on purchases and ?% on the bank interest on the money I already earned AND paid taxes on.

So if I make $100 the government gets $25. If I spend the remaining $75, the government gets another $4.50.

So basically, for every $100 I make, the government gets almost $30 of.

'illegals are only paying $3 per $100.

ILLEGALS are different than IMMIGRANTS.

If you are here legally and play by the rules, I have no problem with you.


-"I'm not predjudice, I hate everybody"

[Homalosa]

You must be young.Nirvana reproduced this song.It is originally by Led Zepplin.



You guys are missing the point here.It is not about race,or helping the poor or having immigrants here.I am all for them bettering thier lives.Just do it LEGAL.It is about the law,they are not above the law no more than any one else.When there is no law then there are only men with guns.

Thanks for the compliment. I am in my mid thirties and am familiar with Led Zepplin. I was just doing a search for lyrics and found this under Nirvana. Still, I think living in Seattle, a city where there is much immigrant scapegoating, lends much to their covering the song.

And if the issue is only about being here legally, then someone must address how much redtape, time and money is involved in the legal process. If employers would only hire legal workers, that process might be shorter or at least wait the effort.

I think what's weird about some of the posts here is that of all people, we, Indians, should know that the federal government only cares about law enforcement when they benefit. If original immigration laws were enforced, treaty rights would hold supreme, and Oklahoma and the rest of Indian Territory would still be Indian land. But oh, homesteaders needed land and that contract was broken. Then in the 40's the war effort needed workers and the Relocation Act appeared. Bottom line, the law is only enforced when its author makes out well.

[Brisa26]

.

[windrider]

YES???
They came over illegally....that is BREAKING THE LAW
They are also proposing to take over several states and make a new country called Aztlan....that is Sedition and Treason and yes that is BREAKING THE LAW....punishable by death by military standards.Sounds to me like you were asleep in class or something.

[Brisa26]

.

[windrider]

I found this and used it in class to for a poetry lesson and to uh, remind folks who the real immigrants are. It's cool when some white folks know where they come from!

"Immigrant Song"
By Nirvana
We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
The hammer of the gods,
Will drive our ships to new lands,
To fight the horde singing and crying:
"Valhalla I am coming!"

On we sweep,
With thrashing oar.
Our only goal will be the western shore.

We come from the land of the ice and snow,
From the midnight sun where the hot springs blow.
Sultry fields of green,
Whispered tales of lore,
Of how we calmed the tides of war,
We are your overlords.

On we sweep,
With thrashing oar.
Our only goal will be the western shore.

So now you'd better stop and rebuild all your ruins,
For peace and trust can win the day despite all your losing"

Dang, what is Kurt saying now?

You must be young.Nirvana reproduced this song.It is originally by Led Zepplin.



You guys are missing the point here.It is not about race,or helping the poor or having immigrants here.I am all for them bettering thier lives.Just do it LEGAL.It is about the law,they are not above the law no more than any one else.When there is no law then there are only men with guns.

[Brisa26]

.

[smilingbear85]

Link

At first I wasn't going to post a response to this thread because in reading many of the previous posts it's saddening to see just how much prejudice there is among ourselves as PEOPLE.
There is one thing I would like to say though, and that is that it's wrong to generalize people of a certain nationality just because you've had a bad experience with one/several. Cuz if that was the case, I've had bad experiences with african-americans, anglos, asians, puerto-ricans, etc, etc.... (I'm not saying I'm a hard person to get along with, *L* ) but I don't go around saying ALL blacks, whites, asians are bad.

I've lived in Chicago, L.A., New York, North Carolina, Florida, Seattle... and you know what? There's all kinds of bad/ good people out there. Some contribute and some don't... all from different backgrounds and cultures.

I always try to tackle this debate in a more individual manner, not just group everybody in a bunch to pass down judgement.

couldn't have said it better myself. if more people thought the same maybe this world would be a better place to live in. but until people get over their superiority complexes, looks we're stuck wading through this ignorance.