Christianity/Catholicism

[*Brown Eyed Gurl*]

I was too lazy to do a search to see if there was already a thread regarding this topic..


Im wondering what ppls opinions are regarding Religous vs. Spiritual..which are ya....do u got to church on sundays....what do u teach ur children....if they forced our language out of us and abused us back in the day how can u want to be a Christian/Catholic...or assorted religion...is the belief scared into u with all that talk of hell and shtuff?....or....are u spiritual in ndn ways only...the whole thing is somthing that i think about all the time....im too urban ndn...apple to some of u..u know who u are..lol....i am the result of being raised by a parent whose parent was in Residental School....anyways I was baptized Catholic and went to Catechism/Confirmation stuff every sunday when i was a kiddo...but then my parents stopped sending us...and that was it...no more sundays in church...the only times i have been in church is when someone dies....I dont want to be Catholic anymore but i cant seem to get it out of me totally...even tho i say im athiest...i spose im not then right?...and my kids are unbaptized, never been to church but they ask me about god and i really dont know what to say....u dont have to comment...im just curious..

[injunboy]

man this is touchy, more touchy than a catholic priest and a room full of little boys. lol

but being catholic isnt the end of the world, even though i consider them worse than terrorists. my kid is gonna be raised tradish cause it makes the most sense and its so natural. but one day if i get betrayed and being one of those seems better than being one of us than i would find it in me to respect her decision.

[Singing Otter]

Girl... coming from the "Bible Belt" I could tell you some stories. I was somewhat of an outcast as a child because I thought for myself. I was my own person and I questioned everything. Soooooooooo when the preacher said "God talks to me and a few selected people" I was like huh? Then who the hell has been talking to me???? And right on cue he said us and us alone because WE are CHOSEN. I was a mere child of eight.... and a sponge. He told my mom that by tying a handkerchief that was blessed around my amputated leg that it'd grow back. Now I wasn't a rocket scientist but I knew that THAT was the biggest crock of horse schitt I'd ever heard. I was tormented by them. Thinking I was evil because I had a mind of my own... evil because I was different in my mannerisms... evil because I was a believer in our ways....evil because I was just different period.

I went back later as an adult in my twenties and the SAME dude was sitting in the SAME place saying the SAME damned thing. The SAME hell and damnation speech for the last twenty years with the begging at middle and end of each service for the poor to become even poorer. I was livid because he was stealing from the community. The people were already poor.... he stole from them and referred to them as his puppies. They were hungry, shoddy, and broke while he was taking the money walking around in $300 suits, $200 shoes, and rolling in a new cadillac every few years. I looked at him and didn't say a word, I wasn't rude at all. I only went because Mom asked. The only difference this time was that he looked at me and said "who are you? I don't care if you don't agree with me. God didn't choose you. YOU ain't nobody." and I just smirked which pissed him off more. Soooo he decides to "annoint" everyone with water.... and a majority of that water ended up on me (guess he had to cast out the demons somehow lol.) Rather than crap a golden cow and raise hell in the church and embarass my mom.... I made my way to the restroom amist the shouting folks and wiped my face and swore that it would be a freezing cold day in the hottest layers of hell (haha) before I went back. Many are indeed called but the true chosen are few. I have many stories.... just as jacked up if not more.

Am I jaded? Yep. But not towards all Christians... just the hypocrits and frauds.

What will I teach my kids? As much as I know... then when they become of age it's up to them to choose. I'd respect their decisions.

[DeusExMachina]

I'm tradish. I don't like Christians too much, and don't trust any of them at all. The religion and the culture that is based on it are a blight upon civilization. They want to keep people ignorant, they are against scientific thought and learning.
My kids will be raised tradish.

[wyo_rose]

I'm tradish and Catholic. Can't I be both? What I believe is there is ONE TRUTH and ONE CREATOR and us little mortals don't even know half the story. Religion is just people's way of relating to that. I think most religions have some good points and some bad, and it just all depends - on everything!

My family's Catholic - ism comes from up at the Salish-Kootenai rez where back-in-the-day some guy had a vision and 3 different parties were sent out LOOKING for the black robes and WANTED the Catholic religion.

As far as I know, down here on the Wind River Rez, kids were treated better in the mission school's than they were in the government schools. My mom was never mistreated by nuns or anything. I used to feel mistreated when my mom MADE me go to church every Sunday with her. Now I feel like GOING ON MY OWN. Will wonders never cease??!!??

In fact the St. Stephen's mission down here incorporates the native language into the mass and has the MOST BEAUTIFUL NDN decorated church!! They have mass at some of the powwows on Sunday morning and even honor the Sundance. I've gone to get smudged and then right to church without a second thought.

I believe in all the tradish ways and in Jesus Christ. I don't think anyone knows EVERYTHING about the Creator and won't until the afterlife - whatever that is.

All my kids were baptized and we went to church every now and then. When one of my daughters was in 2nd and 3rd grade, she'd get up and WALK to church on her own. I was very proud of her, but not even going on my own at the time. After my gramma passed, I just felt the need to go every Sunday and I did for years, although I didn't drag my kids with me.

Everyone has to decide what is right for them. Now that my kids have little ones, it was VERY important for them to get them baptized and I was pleasantly surprised. Whatever you decide for yourself, please teach your kids SOMETHING. I know it's probably hard being in the Urban setting, but they might be NEEDING that connection to the Creator.

[oufeehc]

are you guys all serious?! the reason you all dont like christians or catholics is because you think they are closed-minded bible thumping jerks, but if you look back at yourself, you are what you hate! you are closed minded. who cares what somebody beleives? as long as they get to know God in their own way, it doesnt matter! catholics, muslims, jews, and all of the other religions (including indian religions) all have the same God, if you believe there is only one God, then we are all worshiping the same God. all we need to care about is what we are doing. and if you havent guessed by know, i am catholic, and i am involved in the indian beliefs too. there is a possibility that an individual can find middle ground, without stupid jokes about preists and little kids, ok, so just think about that, please. thank you

[Singing Otter]

are you guys all serious?! the reason you all dont like christians or catholics is because you think they are closed-minded bible thumping jerks, but if you look back at yourself, you are what you hate! you are closed minded. who cares what somebody beleives? as long as they get to know God in their own way, it doesnt matter! catholics, muslims, jews, and all of the other religions (including indian religions) all have the same God, if you believe there is only one God, then we are all worshiping the same God. all we need to care about is what we are doing. and if you havent guessed by know, i am catholic, and i am involved in the indian beliefs too. there is a possibility that an individual can find middle ground, without stupid jokes about preists and little kids, ok, so just think about that, please. thank you

Did you read what I wrote or are you not referring to me? Just wanting to set the record straight. I don't like liars, thieves, and hypocrits.

[oufeehc]

man this is touchy, more touchy than a catholic priest and a room full of little boys. lol

but being catholic isnt the end of the world, even though i consider them worse than terrorists. my kid is gonna be raised tradish cause it makes the most sense and its so natural. but one day if i get betrayed and being one of those seems better than being one of us than i would find it in me to respect her decision.

then again, navajos are good for nothing drunk sheep eaters who can only weave and make generic looking jewlery., see how it feels, catholics can strike back, too

[Joe G]

Yeah and what do atheists yell at ummm that special time? oh evolution!? oh cosmic accident? oh me? just curious

[Singing Otter]

Yeah and what do atheists yell at ummm that special time? oh evolution!? oh cosmic accident? oh me? just curious

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA woooooooooooooow

[*Brown Eyed Gurl*]

Yeah and what do atheists yell at ummm that special time? oh evolution!? oh cosmic accident? oh me? just curious

I yell...."biitch"

[Zorro]

I like stained glass windows.

[Singing Otter]

I yell...."biitch"

lmao u ain't right hahaha

[chickendad]

Believe what you want or feel. I too was brought up in the Bible belt, where people would start rolling on the floor, going into trances. But it didn't feel right to me. I believe in the Great Spirit, Creator. I believe everything has a spirit of it's own and I try to respect them. My problem with the worlds main three religions is that they say unless you follow their ways you'll go to hell. So I ask them what about those who haven't heard your beliefs, do they go to hell. What about the Elders who lived so long ago who didn't hear your words, will they go to hell, and most say yes, because ( for example only), they didn't take Christ into their hearts. Well, I don't feel any God would do that to his/her creation. I feel God speaks to all diffenently. Look back into history, most peoples of the world at some time had beliefs simular to ours before the three other religions came. So I feel the Great Spirit was talking to everyone. If you don't think everything has a spirit. Walk outside, look at the trees, birds, animals, the land, everything, and you'll feel that there is something behind it all.

[One Hot Mama]

Over here our people have always known who Creator is, sought Him face to face, listened for His Word, walked in His ways, and their faith in Him will be what they will stand on when they stand before Him at the end of their journey to the Spirit World. There are among some of us the stories of Creator Son, known as Pale Healer by the Cherokee, Cloud Rider by the Kiowa, and White otter by the Dwamish, and by other names too, who came here to Turtle Island to give Words of Life. He healed the sick and raised the dead, spoke of the Creator's Way. Given the history, I think our people have lived far closer to the "christian" faith than the vast majorities of christians have.

That being said, if one looks at the life and teachings of Jesus, one realizes He speaks the truth in how we are to live, and His teachings do not contradict what the Creator gave to our ancestors so long ago. The main 2: Love the Creator with all of your mind and strength and spirit(paraphrased), and love your neighbor as yourself. Where does that contradict our traditions?

If Creator Son, Jesus, is the Way of salvation, and His sacrifice the payment for the forgiveness of our wrongdoings and the healing for Creation, where is the problem? We all know white folks have misrepresented themselves and everyone else, have claimed they know the mind of God and that we have to be like them to please God. They have also misrepresented themselves as emissaries of Christ, and distorted who He was, is, and is to be. Personally, I despise the church and the "churchianity" most so-called christians practice.

What I do love, is our Creator, who sent His Son to reach us and teach us, and to die in our place so that we might be free from the evil ones of the spirit world who would drag us down in sorrow and suffering and destruction. When I go to water in the mornings, when I smudge, or lay down corn meal or tobacco, when I dance, when I pray, when I sing the old songs, I do these for Him and for love of Him, and as love to Him, and I know He receives them with Love.

The church tells me I can't do this, its "demonic" and I should quit the "Indian" stuff. Well, He never told me any such thing, so I keep doing the "Indian" stuff and have pretty much turned my back on the Church. There's quite a few of us Native Jesus-followers who have rebuked the assimilate/acculturate heresy and worship as NDN's, not apples. Doesn't make us popular with other Christians, but who cares?

Personally, if all of us who follow Christ are part of the "Body of Christ"(as the church calls itself), then I am a middle finger, flying freely in the face of the rest of the Body. The church can take that any way they choose.

And I go to sweat, and share the canupa, and go to stomp and other ceremonies with traditionals with NO problems...we are all worshipping Creator, praying for Mother Earth and our fellow creations, for our people and families, and for ourselves. There is no conflict there. NDN's shouldn't argue over beliefs anyway...it's disrespectful to Creator and our ancestors.