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  • Native Gangs

    I had a couple of indepth conversations about Indian youth recently. Today's conversation was about Native gangs.

    Every generation of Indian youth seems to incorporate what is going on in popular culture. In this current generation, this includes gangs and gang culture.

    One person expressed that gangs are like tribes. They offer a sense of belonging, family and protection. What do you think?

    One thing is for sure, where ever there are Indian youth.... there are gangs. They are prevelent in urban areas such as Minneapolis, Sioux City, Rapid City, Tulsa and Phoenix. But they now seem to be equally prevelent on reservations and other Indian communities.

    What is your take?
    Last edited by WhoMe; 01-14-2009, 09:16 PM.
    Powwows will continue to evolve in many directions. It is inevitable.

  • #2
    Wow, whome, I haven't run into NDN gangs at. Not in the city near me or on the Res when I go there. That's totally new to me.

    Whe I have seen and heard is a youth here or a youth there talking street rap and dressing all gangsta style. But not actually belonging to a gang. Not an NDN gang anyway.

    Comment


    • #3
      One of the primary reasons that they are proliferating in our communities is the gang mentality of being distrustful of outsiders and other similar beliefs is really exploited. If you think, our people really have issues with reporting our own to outside agencies such as the police and Ministry of Children and Family Services. In Canada, we have over a 100 years of mostly negative experiences with the RCMP. Over that period of time, we develop from an early age to not talk to the police and never provide them with information. This really helps the gangs. Additionally, because so many of our communities experience abject poverty, the gangs will provide certain people with TVs and computers. They will initially ask for nothing in return. After a couple of months/years, the gangs start keeping or doing illegal things right next to somebody who is a lawabiding person normally. There are a couple of things at play here. First the person doesn't want to bite the hand that feeds them. Sometimes they are given money. Second and this plays into our systemic distrust of outsiders; we don't want to "betray" somebody from our people. We are not willing to give up one of our own to mostly "WHITE" people. So our misguided sense of loyalty is exploited; albeit willingly. I know all of this because I have worked with current and former gang members from the prairies. When I meet with people I try to explain that these gang members are not robin hood type characters. Most of the drugs, guns, prostitution and other illegal activities are primarily sold to other Aboriginal/ndns. These same gang members are predators. They actively recruit young ndns/First Nation when they are feeling vulnerable in their lives. Its a lot easier to get somebody to join when they have dysfunctional families. Youth who have both parents and are an active part of their kids lives are less likely to have low self-esteem. They don't need to get approval from non-relatives, as their family is closely knit. Its the feelings of disconnectedness which most charismatic and strong willed people play on when the recruiting is implemented. Again, it starts out by giving these youth simple things such as Ipods, laptop computers and the like. Sometimes it may even be a meal at McDonalds or a joint or some alcohol. Whatever the youth wants the gangs provide them. Initially there is no cost associated with it but then after the hooks are in the facade comes off and as time goes by these youth or families are made feel a sense of obligation to the gang or the members of the gang. This is when loyalty, family trust, belief in our people and other such drivel is trotted out so that potential recruits or getting people to look the other way when illegal activity occurs. I am not sure if this is what you are lookikng for but this has been my experience.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by badmaninc View Post
        One of the primary reasons that they are proliferating in our communities is the gang mentality of being distrustful of outsiders and other similar beliefs is really exploited. If you think, our people really have issues with reporting our own to outside agencies such as the police and Ministry of Children and Family Services. In Canada, we have over a 100 years of mostly negative experiences with the RCMP. Over that period of time, we develop from an early age to not talk to the police and never provide them with information. This really helps the gangs. Additionally, because so many of our communities experience abject poverty, the gangs will provide certain people with TVs and computers. They will initially ask for nothing in return. After a couple of months/years, the gangs start keeping or doing illegal things right next to somebody who is a lawabiding person normally. There are a couple of things at play here. First the person doesn't want to bite the hand that feeds them. Sometimes they are given money. Second and this plays into our systemic distrust of outsiders; we don't want to "betray" somebody from our people. We are not willing to give up one of our own to mostly "WHITE" people. So our misguided sense of loyalty is exploited; albeit willingly. I know all of this because I have worked with current and former gang members from the prairies. When I meet with people I try to explain that these gang members are not robin hood type characters. Most of the drugs, guns, prostitution and other illegal activities are primarily sold to other Aboriginal/ndns. These same gang members are predators. They actively recruit young ndns/First Nation when they are feeling vulnerable in their lives. Its a lot easier to get somebody to join when they have dysfunctional families. Youth who have both parents and are an active part of their kids lives are less likely to have low self-esteem. They don't need to get approval from non-relatives, as their family is closely knit. Its the feelings of disconnectedness which most charismatic and strong willed people play on when the recruiting is implemented. Again, it starts out by giving these youth simple things such as Ipods, laptop computers and the like. Sometimes it may even be a meal at McDonalds or a joint or some alcohol. Whatever the youth wants the gangs provide them. Initially there is no cost associated with it but then after the hooks are in the facade comes off and as time goes by these youth or families are made feel a sense of obligation to the gang or the members of the gang. This is when loyalty, family trust, belief in our people and other such drivel is trotted out so that potential recruits or getting people to look the other way when illegal activity occurs. I am not sure if this is what you are lookikng for but this has been my experience.
        Good post.


        Why must I feel like that..why must I chase the cat?


        "When I was young man I did some dumb things and the elders would talk to me. Sometimes I listened. Time went by and as I looked around...I was the elder".

        Mr. Rossie Freeman

        Comment


        • #5
          Hmmmm......my take on them...........I just think they're a bunch of little kids who need their arse beat.....and brought back to reality....with active community involvement, it would help....but most natives don't care about anyone but themselves....so that wouldn't work.....couple of years ago, I got into it with a gang.....I beat 3 of them down and showed them true gangsta style LOL!!!!.....anyway, none of them bother me......a couple of them sometimes come over to my house and talk to me about military life and one of them is leaving for bootcamp in about 3 months.....they just need someone to listen to them and show them the true aggressive side (well for some anyway) to have reality hit them head on.......
          sigpic

          ...And shephards we shall be. For thee my lord, for thee. Power hath descended forth from thy hand. That our feet may swiftly carry out thy command. So we shall flow a river forth to thee. And teeming with souls shall it ever be. E Nomini Patri, E Fili, E Spiritu Sancti.

          Comment


          • #6
            I agree

            They'll find out when they get sentenced to prison. This is too good a topic and way too much room for....................nevermind. Gangs are for boys that like boys.
            Last edited by farmer ned; 01-15-2009, 10:41 AM. Reason: they'll never understand, ever

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by farmer ned View Post
              They'll find out when they get sentenced to prison. This is too good a topic and way too much room for....................nevermind
              The problem with simply sentencing them to prison, its like they are attending finishing school or college for criminals. If people are to make a successful transition away from the gang sending them to prison and warehousing them is not a solution. Drugs, alcohol and every vice available in society is also readily available in prison. Prisons and corrections in general are the biggest reruiting agency for gangs. When the prairies experienced integration problems with gang bangers; the really bad prisoners were shipped out of the region. They were sent to different provinces/regions. These inmates turned around and expanded their membership. Now we have Aboriginal gangs in every province and territory. I am not suggesting doing away with prison sentence but we need to develop something for when these people are released. Being ndn means we are all usually from a rez or community. These places aren't just where we are from. The land and its people always ties us to the place in ways non-ndns couldn't understand. It should be easy to move away from high unemployment rates, suicides, sexual abuse, rampant substance abuse, domestic violence and the like. But because everybody we know and our whole way of life is centred around where we are from. Its not easy to leave that; there is a certain comfort in knowing where your people and you are from. That is the way our relatives who currently live off reserve in urban settings feel. Where I am from we recently put in 20 rental units. Over 100 people applied for them. Each person said their situation was dire. If we were to build 150 homes, they would all be rented out and that's just to our band members. So because of all these different reasons, gangs are big concern. We can make simple arguments such as lets ship them out off of our communities but then you realize there is a gang banger from almost every family. Who do you tell to leave and who to stay. Removing them doesn't solve the problems; it only moves the problems to urban settings. Many of our ndn people lead lives of quiet and sometimes not so quiet rage. As I have said I have been witness to all of this and it really makes me feel angry, hurt, bitterness. Its not only for them but also for us who live in this all of the time. It is supposed to be survival of the fittest but I don't want to be the one who does the cull. I am just a person who wants to live a good life and be a good example for my children and their children. I don't want to be a role model for others. We all have a responsiblity to do the same for our families.

              Comment


              • #8
                We have this problem all through Alberta too. What alot of people don't understand is the majority of these kids have so many underlying problems that got them there in the first place. They didn't just decide one day oh I think I'll be a gang member today and do all sorts of stupid dangerous things. Most of them are just looking for somewhere to belong. What they are trying to do in different areas up her is get the kids involved in other activities such as cadets even on the rez.
                ClothDancer02

                Comment


                • #9
                  badmaninc serves an awsome point right there.

                  if you wanna see a good visual of what he is talking about watch the movie "BLOOD IN BLOOD OUT" that movies is exactly what he is talking about. another movie about gang life is STRYKER, about a boy who wants to join indian posse.

                  Aboriginal gangs in canada kind of began in the Manitoba area then moved to the max security prisons in sask and alberta and ontario. You also cant assume that all gangsters are 100% evil, but some people are just so involved by family or just having no one at all. I know some who wish they never lived that way of life, but they still keep their families close and out of the gang life but growing up in that life it is not easy to get away from.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    according to the navajo police we got gangs around here but mostly its just spray paint gangs i think. sure aint chicken to tag up road signs or property. safety wise its never ok to spray up a guardrail end treatment, delineators or warning signs but its soo visible to alot of people and thats what matters.

                    there was some simple rules to crossing out somebodys tag in their area. im sooo glad that these are pretend gangs and dont follow through cause wed have a massacre around here.

                    in my own life i was never in a gang. just friends with gang members in orange county. it wasnt for me but i could appreciate some things about that life. for one, everyday there was no daily plan of destruction. i had alot of fun cause we did things together. if we went to a club we all went to a club and we just had fun in our own corner for example.

                    i was kinda talkin about a nice stereo for my car and redmon shows up with amps, equalizer, a box, 6x9s and a pull out kenwood. it wasnt new. haha but i took it anyways.

                    i am not even defending ganglife but its soo differnt from rez gangs. i would never join one but i can appreciate some things errr alot of things.
                    thanks dad for showing me the way, teaching me the language, and not leaving my mother...*L*

                    *RoUg3 MoD sTaTuS*

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by injunboy View Post
                      according to the navajo police we got gangs around here but mostly its just spray paint gangs
                      injun,

                      Where I used to live, I had some hardcore gangbangin friends. I knew they were always packin' weapons and know they were into some bad things. But they were my friends and always had my back.
                      Powwows will continue to evolve in many directions. It is inevitable.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        a lot of ndn in jail are IBH members... I know ndn's in okc who run with mexican gangs... hood life I guess....
                        Dayum I make some keen DrumSticks!!!!!!sigpic

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Ran with some of my friends from here, got to the point wher I got tats and carried a live weapon...most I ever did was fight hand to hand.....then my friend got killed and another one of my friends was paralyzed from the waist down from a drive-by.....about that time I started getting more involved with school and what I wanted to do with my life.....ah well.....my tats remind me of my time banging...LOL!!!.....just some little shyt whop thoguht he was a badazz.....now that I experienced a "real" fight, I am a badazz....LOL!!!!
                          sigpic

                          ...And shephards we shall be. For thee my lord, for thee. Power hath descended forth from thy hand. That our feet may swiftly carry out thy command. So we shall flow a river forth to thee. And teeming with souls shall it ever be. E Nomini Patri, E Fili, E Spiritu Sancti.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Emulation?

                            Trying to be "hip" or "in" alot of our kids are getting lost in the sauce. Some of them are coming from homes that are on the brink....i.e. Mom and Dad are robbing Peter to pay Paul and Junior is not getting the attention they need. Hell....Mom and Dad usually aren't in the picture in some cases..... Think about the last time you actually sat down with your kids and shared a home cooked meal.....? Asked them who their buddies and pals were? Knew who they were dating? Have they even been attending school? Yes the questions keep popping in my head. Another problem these days is a Rite of Passage....Several of our young people....both male and female don't experience our traditional rites of passage. Seems pop culture has overshadowed that essential process....Either those Rites are overlooked or they are not readily available. Certainly there is no "cure all" or some magic solution to educate or even redirect our kids, but we need to encourage our kids to not just look ,but see what gangs are doing to a number of communities. It bothers me to turn on the news and right away they are highlighting or emphasizing some violent act or situation that took place in an aboriginal community? What about the positive things taking place? Seems violence sells and stimulates people? I've visited a couple of my relatives in prison. No, not a Mickey Mouse jail.....Prison....Going into Sing Sing some 20 years ago scared the living chit out of me....My 1st and last time.....When I was a Frosh in H.S. I particpated in the Scared Straight Program and spent the day at Riker's Island prison (NY NY)....Found out just how "tough" I was.....I've visited the Brooklyn House of Detention....No not as an inmate.....to visit relatives....Not proud of that fact, but thats just the way it is.....

                            Stay tuned....next time i'll share some tidbits on the System and why our kids keep lapping up all this chit being spoon fed to them.....Ta ta 4 now
                            "She also has a very soft skin. The only trouble with snake women is they copulate with horses, which makes them strange to me. She say's she doesn't. That's why I call her "Doesn't Like Horses". But, of course, she's lying."

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Coyot_In_The_House View Post
                              Trying to be "hip" or "in" alot of our kids are getting lost in the sauce. Some of them are coming from homes that are on the brink....i.e. Mom and Dad are robbing Peter to pay Paul and Junior is not getting the attention they need. Hell....Mom and Dad usually aren't in the picture in some cases..... Think about the last time you actually sat down with your kids and shared a home cooked meal.....? Asked them who their buddies and pals were? Knew who they were dating? Have they even been attending school? Yes the questions keep popping in my head. Another problem these days is a Rite of Passage....Several of our young people....both male and female don't experience our traditional rites of passage. Seems pop culture has overshadowed that essential process....Either those Rites are overlooked or they are not readily available. Certainly there is no "cure all" or some magic solution to educate or even redirect our kids, but we need to encourage our kids to not just look ,but see what gangs are doing to a number of communities. It bothers me to turn on the news and right away they are highlighting or emphasizing some violent act or situation that took place in an aboriginal community? What about the positive things taking place? Seems violence sells and stimulates people? I've visited a couple of my relatives in prison. No, not a Mickey Mouse jail.....Prison....Going into Sing Sing some 20 years ago scared the living chit out of me....My 1st and last time.....When I was a Frosh in H.S. I particpated in the Scared Straight Program and spent the day at Riker's Island prison (NY NY)....Found out just how "tough" I was.....I've visited the Brooklyn House of Detention....No not as an inmate.....to visit relatives....Not proud of that fact, but thats just the way it is.....

                              Stay tuned....next time i'll share some tidbits on the System and why our kids keep lapping up all this chit being spoon fed to them.....Ta ta 4 now

                              your words are true. i grew up in a traditional way, but i am only missing my language and i am currently learning....i know abit. these youth need to staighten up now nd see whats going....
                              A Warriors Pride

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