Chicken Dance vs. Round Bustle

[WhoMe]

The Chicken Dance has a separate origin story, dance style and bustle differentiating it from the Round Bustle Dance.

Yet, they look close enough to be the same dance. Some people even think round bustle dancers ARE chicken dancers.

Should the Chicken Dance and the Round Bustle Dance be two separate dance categories?

Whatch'a think?

[danbear]

hello whome you see to be a pretty knowledgeable person,(ive seen alot of your posts). being from the southeast i have not had the opportunity to see the differnce between the round bustle and chicken dance. could you enlighten me with some history of the round bustle dance(if its ok to post here) and some of the differences between the two. it would be greatly appreciated. as far as puttin them in 2 separate categories if they are as you say 2 different dances then yes separate them into 2 categories so that people don't get them mixed up.

[CloudN9ne]

the dance of round bustle is a dance that the yakima and nez perce people did for the same reasons for the chicken dance! al though it looks simular but it is a very different style of dance.

[Crowmagnum]

I'm going to have to agree with my boy Dan. Since they're two different dances, they shouldn't be done together, no matter how similar.

[stater chick]

well the chicken and round bustle are very different different orgin adifferent story different styler ECT. so they should be in different categories!!!

[hahtalekin]

round bustle V. chicken dance style,????

i will tell you what has been told to me by my elders, the round bustle dance style is more of the straight up style. we are told "you do not get fancy". i am asked by many young dancers who put on a NEW round bustle style outfit, how & why we do this and that, when we round bustle dance. i tell them "i don't mean to sound like i don't want you to learn,but YOU NEED to learn from YOUR elders and listen, and do what they tell you." this is the way i learned, i didn't ask why, i just do what they told me to do!!!

we dance pretty much straight up,with not much bending at the waist. arm movment is by dancers preference,by this i mean the dancers moves his arms as he sees fit. but mostly you will see the arms straight out and bent at the elbows.

sometime you will see a dancer do a forward toe tap and continue with the leg sweeping to the back or vice-versa, i know most of the dancers from long ago danced this way and a few of us still use them old moves or moves similar to them.

i believe the reason that people misinterpret the round bustle as a chicken dance may have came about from the dance our people named the ruffle dance. during this dance us round bustle style dancers mimic the prairie chicken,sage grouse and ruffed grouse courtship rituals.

so if your watching a round bustle/chicken dance catergory or special and you see some dancers that are not using all the moves as a chicken dancer, that dancer maybe doing the old style round bustle dance of the NW.

a point i'd like to make is that people who put up money for these catergories or specials should know that there is a difference.i know there are people who say there is no difference. you go to pow wows and you see a round bustle special advertised, it should be judged as a round bustle style special. just as a chicken dance special is judged as chicken dance style.

one reason i feel this way is that a few of us dress in the NW round bustle style for a round bustle style special or catergory and it turns into a chicken dance special or catergory.it means alot to us who have the respect to maintain our NW round bustle style to dance that style when we have our round bustle outfits on,and not disgrace the teachings our elders have handed down for us to take care of, by changing our style to chicken dance style for that special or catergory just because of money.our teachings should mean more to us than money!!!!

JUDGES NEED to know the differences also, as do the singers. i know many of the younger people around the NW need to learn from their elders also, about the way of the NW style of round bustle dancing as well.

this style of dancing is more than putting an outfit together just to get out there and compete for that all mighty dollar,most of us older dancers have been taught the stories and have outfits that have been handed down from one generation to the next and learned our styles from older brothers,uncles and g-pas who have danced this style way long before us.

as an example the blue beadwork i wear was made by my grandmother for one of my older brothers, and has been handed down through five brothers now including myself,this beadwork was made back in the 40-50's or even ealier. i know a few other round bustle dancers who wear beadwork & even complete outfits today that are just as older or older.

you'll probably notice i didn't post anything about the chicken dance style, the reason for that is, i am not a member of any chicken dance society or am not a person who professes to be an authority on the chicken dance style. but will say i have been encouraged to dance the chicken dance style by people who do know much of the teachings of the chicken dance. and am very thankful for their positive encouragement. nor do i profess to be an authority of the NW round bustle style, just a student.

yeah,i know your going to say that im kind of contradicting my beliefs by saying, im mixing my respect for teachings with competing for money,yeah,yeah. who can truely say he or she doesn't?

so back to the topic YES the two styles should have their own respective catergories.

kunku lawtiwama
yoko? kalo, qo?c ?e hexnu?

[babygirl_chief_calf]

Things are done differently everywhere.

[PoW-WoW_QuEeN]

I think that it would have to be chicken dance thingy..LOL all the way im an all out chicken dancer fan..LOL well for a couple of peeps and yea so i would be all out chicken dancer..so yea pce out homiez!!

[YoungBear]

chicken dance -vs- round bustle

I believe that both dances should be seperated. they both originated in seperate parts this native country. the chicken dance is from blackfeet country and i believe the round bustle came from shoshone country. i can be wrong, but alot of shoshone teach the round bustle and i see them at the powwows in shoshone country. some families have different ways of adding and altering each bustle and outfit are belonging to different families (families own styles). more less it is the family that carry the teaching of these dances. dont know to much about the chicken dance, but both dances are very unique and deserve their own respect.dont want to compare two totally different tribes and and put them together and say " your the same".Just like all us natives we are not the same, were a all individual nations. so they are totally different so they should be kept as seperated catagories.

[LISA IRONMAKER]

i will tell you what has been told to me by my elders, the round bustle dance style is more of the straight up style. we are told "you do not get fancy". i am asked by many young dancers who put on a NEW round bustle style outfit, how & why we do this and that, when we round bustle dance. i tell them "i don't mean to sound like i don't want you to learn,but YOU NEED to learn from YOUR elders and listen, and do what they tell you." this is the way i learned, i didn't ask why, i just do what they told me to do!!!

we dance pretty much straight up,with not much bending at the waist. arm movment is by dancers preference,by this i mean the dancers moves his arms as he sees fit. but mostly you will see the arms straight out and bent at the elbows.

sometime you will see a dancer do a forward toe tap and continue with the leg sweeping to the back or vice-versa, i know most of the dancers from long ago danced this way and a few of us still use them old moves or moves similar to them.

i believe the reason that people misinterpret the round bustle as a chicken dance may have came about from the dance our people named the ruffle dance. during this dance us round bustle style dancers mimic the prairie chicken,sage grouse and ruffed grouse courtship rituals.

so if your watching a round bustle/chicken dance catergory or special and you see some dancers that are not using all the moves as a chicken dancer, that dancer maybe doing the old style round bustle dance of the NW.

a point i'd like to make is that people who put up money for these catergories or specials should know that there is a difference.i know there are people who say there is no difference. you go to pow wows and you see a round bustle special advertised, it should be judged as a round bustle style special. just as a chicken dance special is judged as chicken dance style.

one reason i feel this way is that a few of us dress in the NW round bustle style for a round bustle style special or catergory and it turns into a chicken dance special or catergory.it means alot to us who have the respect to maintain our NW round bustle style to dance that style when we have our round bustle outfits on,and not disgrace the teachings our elders have handed down for us to take care of, by changing our style to chicken dance style for that special or catergory just because of money.our teachings should mean more to us than money!!!!

JUDGES NEED to know the differences also, as do the singers. i know many of the younger people around the NW need to learn from their elders also, about the way of the NW style of round bustle dancing as well.

this style of dancing is more than putting an outfit together just to get out there and compete for that all mighty dollar,most of us older dancers have been taught the stories and have outfits that have been handed down from one generation to the next and learned our styles from older brothers,uncles and g-pas who have danced this style way long before us.

as an example the blue beadwork i wear was made by my grandmother for one of my older brothers, and has been handed down through five brothers now including myself,this beadwork was made back in the 40-50's or even ealier. i know a few other round bustle dancers who wear beadwork & even complete outfits today that are just as older or older.

you'll probably notice i didn't post anything about the chicken dance style, the reason for that is, i am not a member of any chicken dance society or am not a person who professes to be an authority on the chicken dance style. but will say i have been encouraged to dance the chicken dance style by people who do know much of the teachings of the chicken dance. and am very thankful for their positive encouragement. nor do i profess to be an authority of the NW round bustle style, just a student.

yeah,i know your going to say that im kind of contradicting my beliefs by saying, im mixing my respect for teachings with competing for money,yeah,yeah. who can truely say he or she doesn't?

so back to the topic YES the two styles should have their own respective catergories.

kunku lawtiwama
yoko? kalo, qo?c ?e hexnu?

I agree with hahtalekin.........I believe that the two categories should be separated based on their different ways of dancing. hahtalekin.........I really enjoyed reading your quote.......keep up the good dancing, beliefs and tradishns. Always respect ur elders........

[oldstylechicken]

I strongly believe they should be seperated because of there origin and the dance style are way different from each other round bustle dancers are more upright and with a steady dance step when danceing; while the chicken dancer has head, shoulder, and body movement; plus chest sticks out and more choppy steps then the roud bustle. but both have a slight bounce to the drum beat while dancing, so i think they should be in different catagories at dances across powwow country.

[sookout sh'nob]

yeah,i know your going to say that im kind of contradicting my beliefs by saying, im mixing my respect for teachings with competing for money,yeah,yeah. who can truely say he or she doesn't?

Me. I find other, more creative ways to contradict myself!

That said, moderate gambling is a pretty traditional thing in our area - it's like that a lof of places, I think. I think maybe contest dancing could be thought of as a kind of gamble - pitting your own skill and luck against someone else's. That's gambling, yah? So maybe it's not much of a contradiction after all.

Not much of a gamble when other dancer's friends and relatives are judging the contest though, is it.

[tsalagigirl]

Thanks for the explanation of the difference of the 2 types of this dance. Chicken Dance is my absolute favorite style of dance. Being in The South, I didn't know about the Round Bustle. Hopefully next year I will get to travel a lot and see a lot more of teh different styles of dance.

[heartbeat]

Round Bustle

As stated before, the Round bustle needs to in a category of it's own, although you see roundbustle specials it's usually the chicken dancers that get picked dressed somewhat like roundbustlers dancing like chickens, yet when you see a chicken dance special or contest it's still the chicken dancers that place. Problem is that people forget what the round bustle style is and it should be broken down for them. to begin with, the Duck and dive is not a chicken dance style song. second many of these questions could be expressed in a Round bustle forum of its own... I asked for one... but the response I got back was there wasn't enough discussion on it. Well I think there is because it appears that there are unanswered questions out there that people are led to assume. Stop the ignorance and spread the good word across indian country because we are not only exploited ourselves we are misinforming the next generation that doesn't know what to believe.

that's all (yox kalo)

[Mz_FoXy_MoMmA]

hmm...interesting. I think that if there were enough round bustle dancers out there, a separate round bustle category would be awesome! But a lot of the times there are hardly enough chikk'n or round bustle dancers to make up their own category by themselves (around this way, anyway)...it sux when u have one without the other...or one that excludes the other. MYSELF, I'd rather see them have their own (chikk'n/round bustle) category TOGETHER than NONE at ALL...it's better than having either of them compete with the Traditional dancers...not to say that they're alike or have the same origins...but a judge can still pick who they think is the best out of the two. Maybe a chicken dancer wins...maybe a round bustle dancer wins...it always gets really political when it comes to these two categories...many want to put a claim on where these two dances came from...and I believe that YES, they may have started the dance...or their own version of it. But today, MANY different tribes from all over have taken this dance to different places...some good...some a little bit crazy...but nevertheless; they're out there doing it so lets give at least give ‘em their own category…even if they have to be together for a little while