leggins vs. knee-bands

[scottlollar]

Howdy!
I was watching some younger dancers this weekend and noticed something. Most of them were wearing more 'contemporary' N Trad. outfits than I am used to. So, this is where my question comes from. I was taught that as modest people we cover our legs when we dance. If you aren't wearing leggins, then you need to wear long shorts with side tabs, knee-bands, tall socks, anklets, etc. Well, I've seen a lot of folks lately not wearing the socks with the outfit. So it looks like the outfit stops just below the knee almost. To me it isn't traditional. It doesn't look complete, and I counsel against it.
But, until recently I've always worn leggins with my outfit instead of the knee-bands/side-tabs/knee-socks option. I certainly understand wanting to remain cooler in Texas. But, it goes counter to what I was taught. So, maybe you folks can enlighten me.

[redthunder]

Well, I think the first thing to remember is Powwows aren't traditional. You have so many mixed nations dancing within the same categories, it has just become a social event over the years. There are traditions within Powwows however like when a feather drops etc.A lot of people wear biker shorts under their aprons, including myself.

[stacey curry]

My sons danced from tiny tots up and is going into mens traditional, We make him leggings with his design for contemp. traditional, and he just uses beaded leg bands for straighter old style., with the rest of his hiders, side drops, furs, ect... look up Clayton Broncheau on google. After awhile your son will decide what he wants, making new outfits all the time, just bigger is a good way to keep him going.

[tiyospaye]

Well I have to say this that is the way traditions get lost, having said that. Yes there are lots of short cuts being taken, I wear traditional legging and a breech set. I do wear bike type shorts under them just cause today, have to be careful with the public that comes to Pow Wows. And offending certian ones. Another thing I have seen lots of instead of Mocs men are wearing the water shoes< not sure what for? Maybe someone here knows that....lol. I guess it comes under changing with the times and cost, I still use all glass beads, but many
are going to plastic cause or cost and weight. I think that it is better to teach our children the right way if at all possible. So many songs so many dances, and so many traditions being lost to the times. So the thing I would say is find out which Nation your are Honoring and follow the Ways the best you can.
As you know all Tribes and Nation did thing different

Walk in Beauty
Harold

[scottlollar]

That's what I was saying. All of my elders said, "Indins are modest people. Women wear shawls and men cover their legs in the arena." So, it just seems odd to me that folks aren't being taught the same way. I tried my best to teach what I could between dancing, saying always, 'The way I was taught...'
I wear shorts under any of my outfits. It's just smart. Originally, I wore full leggings and deer-toe clackers under the knee. I often felt that the guys who wear the fringed knee-bands and goats and ankle bells just weren't doing it right - that's the way I was taught (that wholoe 'men wear leggings' thing). Recently, though, I was made a real nice set of knee bands and arm bands to match the rest of my outfit, so I opted to wear them. But, I made sure to wear long knee-socks, under the fringe to cover my legs - I still had the long shorts under the aprons anyway. That way, my legs were covered, except for my knees, but the fringe on my aprons covers them pretty well.

[redthunder]

That's what I was saying. All of my elders said, "Indins are modest people. Women wear shawls and men cover their legs in the arena." So, it just seems odd to me that folks aren't being taught the same way. I tried my best to teach what I could between dancing, saying always, 'The way I was taught...'
I wear shorts under any of my outfits. It's just smart. Originally, I wore full leggings and deer-toe clackers under the knee. I often felt that the guys who wear the fringed knee-bands and goats and ankle bells just weren't doing it right - that's the way I was taught (that wholoe 'men wear leggings' thing). Recently, though, I was made a real nice set of knee bands and arm bands to match the rest of my outfit, so I opted to wear them. But, I made sure to wear long knee-socks, under the fringe to cover my legs - I still had the long shorts under the aprons anyway. That way, my legs were covered, except for my knees, but the fringe on my aprons covers them pretty well.

Well, traditionally, for ceremonies (sweat, sundance, shake tents, etc.) guys were not required to cover their legs, but woman were required to wear long skirts (dresses).

[danceman457]

well to comment on this, i wear leggings, and workout shorts underneath then i also wear side tabs and aprons. one of my friends wears just shorts and socks with side tabs and aprons and then his brother dances in shorts with out sock.. but he wears knee bands aprons and side tabs.... so thats three different ways i think it's all about Preference

[tigger]

it's all personal preference.......like anything you do on your outfit........it's supposed to be how you want it

[sookout sh'nob]

Sounds funny to me - like boarding school talk. Look at old photos (that weren't staged) of dancing and most guys have large areas of their bodies uncovered. In some places, people even went around near in the buck! Does that make them show offs? immodest? Vain? Way way back, grass dancers didn't wear much of anything, but painted their bodies instead.

What about sweat - all the guys have their shirts off and it's a public setting within the community, does that make them immodest?

How traditional are glass seed beads? Not very, man. Plenty of old ceramic beads, most of the surviving examples of which are very irregular and quite a bit larger than seed beads.

Water mocs = wet arenas... sure beats losing your favorite moccasins to a sloppy White Earth mudhole. They're easier to clean afterwards (cleaning mud off of leather can be tough) and don't turn crusty and flat from being wet (which also weakens the leathers weave) The do make my heel itch to beat hell though.

[stacey curry]

Keeping boys dancing will keep traditions going, leggings of any style will be fine. Respectfull of elders, feathers and oneself is probalbly the best lessons being taught to youngsters. Raising a dancer over 18 years (I've noticed)the ones that keep dancing are the ones who are never out of an outfit. Keep making larger ones and let him help. Traditions are so important but if the boy not on the floor he will be in trouble.