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Who can be a Straight Dancer

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    _wuliechsin_
    Beadboy

  • _wuliechsin_
    replied
    This thread is getting very interesting. Keep it up, I would like to hear what you have to say Historian.

    Leave a comment:

  • Historian
    Experienced

  • Historian
    replied
    An interesting discussion.

    Leave a comment:

  • records_all_drumz
    Junior Dancer

  • records_all_drumz
    replied
    Originators hmmmmmm? Don't know about any of that, as all I know my Pawnee relatives have their own way of Hethoskah! They have their own songs, their own veterans songs, own scalp dance songs, trot dance (which they keep at home), flag song. That's not to say other tribes don't have these as i don't know, I just know what our tribe has. All are original, nothing taken from other surrounding tribes. We hear alot of our tunes from surronding tribes, but that is a whole different story.

    Pawnees, Wichitas and Arikara's share some common ground in regards to this style of dance. There are other dances our tribe has which no other tribe has since we have four main (bands) groups that make up the tribe. These ceremonial dances have similar songs of our war dance and our war dance came from these ceremonial dances. Our very own ceremonials, now in our opinion that is original, we received from the creator, how original do you want to be?

    We have never sold out our dances to non-indians either, as the creator gave it to us, if he wanted other tribes to have it the creator would have chosen them.

    Leave a comment:

  • CHEROSAGE
    cherosage

  • CHEROSAGE
    replied
    We (Osages) have Three main dances, Hominy, Greyhorse and Pahuska. It is true that the Poncas are attributed for giving us our Ilonshka. Some Poncas and Poncamixes do come and help our Drum Keepers.

    The Poncas have also given the Apaches in the Ft Sill OK area their Formal Dance. I was honored to be able to dance this dance while stationed at Ft Sill. I have also been priviledged to dance the Black Moccasin dance with these Apaches. A-Ho!

    The O ma ha's still open their dances with a tail session.

    The greatest thing anyone can see is several hundred Straight dancers dancing at one time. Both very young to very old. We do have a guest section of our seating. If anyone has the oppertunity to attend an Ilonshka/Hethuska do so. Be advised that these ceremonies are not the Powwow Intertribal dances.

    Leave a comment:

  • Guest
    Guest

  • STATE
    Guest replied
    Right on!!!The Poncas are the originators and gave the dance to other tribes. One being the Comanches. Man, if I tell all the Comanches that I heard a Comanche say they got straight dance from the Kiowas..............no way, no how, no, no, no. LOL The Poncas gave the dance and the songs to other tribes and the Osages have beautiful ceromonies each year. Same with the Poncas, there are over 200 straight dancers in one arena. They follow the strict rites that go with that dance, too. It is a beautiful dance to participate in and to watch. And so true, every southern man eventually gets to straight dance , because they get too slow to fancy!!! LOL My dad included. He was a fancy dancer, but eventually became a straight dancer and that was his niche. He won the LittleWalker trophy at Ponca 4 times and had to retire from that arena. He was old school, though, before this era we watch now. But, after all is said and done, it is a true gentleman's dance and I enjoy watching it, whoever is dancing it, as long as they respect it and treat it right.

    Leave a comment:

  • BaloneySkin
    Pow Wow Visitor

  • BaloneySkin
    replied
    Eshop !!

    Shore like it for your handle !!!

    You are correct in that the straight dance is NOT of Osage origin. The Osage people were given this dance, the drums and the songs from the Ponca and Kaw a little over a hundred years ago. There was a reason for this and I will not go into it on these boards. All of it was good and it stll continues to this day in the good spirit that it was given. Nuff said.

    Leave a comment:

  • travelingmocs
    Teen Dancer

  • travelingmocs
    replied
    I would like to add something to the last post. The hethuska came from the Poncas and the Omahas. The Commanches were given the war dance by Poncas. First in like 1917 or soemthing like that, and then in the 60's it was givien back to the commanches by Silvester Warrior.
    The pawnees do have a dance, and several on the pawnee singers like Frank, Herb, Adson and several other people sing at are invited to sing at the Oasge inlonskas..........

    Leave a comment:

  • ComanchEshop
    Pow Wow Visitor

  • ComanchEshop
    replied
    Straight to the point!

    Straight dance of Osage origin? PLEASE! If anyone knows the true history around the Straight dance it comes from the Pawnees! Then the Ohmahas, Poncas, Osages, and there on! I used to here stories of how the Pawnees had to sing for the Osage Elonshska! We Comanches got it from the Kiowas who got it from the Wichitas(relatives to the Pawnees) Delawares probably picked it up after they moved to Oklahoma. I will admit though if anyone wants to see Straight dancing at its best then come to Oklahoma! Be sure and check out the Pawnee, Ponca, Osage and Otoe dances! Nothing but Straight dancers, sometimes hundreds!

    Leave a comment:

  • CEM
    Tiny Tot Dancer

  • CEM
    replied
    One of the things I've been impressed about with the members of the non-Indian Hethushkas is at pow-wows they seem to be some of the first guys dressed and the last to leave. I can think of two men who are almost 70 years old that are always dressed and dance the whole session. I hope the guys you were talking about are the exception rather than the rule. Maybe they were joking or just having a bad day.

    CEM

    Leave a comment:

  • Tsi-tse Wa-tsi
    Tiny Tot Dancer

  • Tsi-tse Wa-tsi
    replied
    Hmm, I've been to all the non-indian Hethuskas several times. I don't ever recall people complaining about putting on there clothes. I also don't recall anyone I have seen getting drunk. Granted I have see members of the groups drink in a social manner, but not to the point of losing control of themselves (both whites and Indians together). These aren't the only Hehuskas where after the dance people get together and visit and share a few drinks. So please enlighted us, who's shoes do you speak of?

    Leave a comment:

  • pablo
    Pow Wow Visitor

  • pablo
    replied
    Yes the Order of the Arrow is a good way to get introduced to the culture, but once you learn about straight dance-get out of the OA. As an organization it has and continues to objectify native people. Do not confuse or identify straight dance and straight dance organizations with the concept of OA and it's "cheerful service". I am not indian and joined a heluska organation made up of almost all non indians and OA types. They b!tch like hell while putting their clothes on and after the dance get sh!t-faced drunk like they are at a college frat party. This lack of respect has turned me off of the group. When I dance, my heart is in that circle- it is where I feel like the person I was meant to be. I think the Poncas made a big mistake in giving the dance to these people, they have imposed all their middle class and boy scout values on it. If this offends anyone so be it, I appologize for the offense, but if the shoe fits...

    Leave a comment:

  • the_powwow_bandit
    Pow Wow Visitor

  • the_powwow_bandit
    replied
    Good Luck to you in getting your dancers started. I hope that a native person in your area will take an interest in you and help you out. The style known today as straight dance is Osage in origin, but the Comanches have a slightly different regalia in that same style. It was taught to me that their regalia differ from the northern traditional because of their confinement by the dominant culture and the attempt by them to force assimilation by taking away eagle feathers, etc... so broadcloth and ribbonwork replaced buckskin and quill or beadwork. Straight dance is a traditional dance, only its the tradition of certain tribes. Your scouts may enjoy researching the original regalia of different tribes and using that to inspire their contemporary regalia. The scouts have been involved in this since the late fifties and early sixties. We have pictures of their participation in the Annual Winnebago Pow Wow from around that time.

    Leave a comment:

  • James Clippinger
    Pow Wow Visitor

  • James Clippinger
    replied
    There are 4 bands of Delaware. 2 in Ok. and 2 in Ont. The two reserves in Ont are Morivian Town and Delware on the Thames. The two reserves are about 70 miles apart. Morivian Town as its name implies were Delware people who followed the Morivian religion. And moved north from Ohio when events forced the move. Morivian Town is about 150 miles East of Detroit. The closest town you would find on the map is Tamesville, Ont. The four bands annually gather together at one of the four locations.
    The two in the OK and the two in Canada are both recognized by their federal governments.

    Leave a comment:

  • Kiwehnzii
    Oldfart

  • Kiwehnzii
    replied
    I could be wrong, but I think the people you may have seen in Ontario are visitors from Oklahoma.

    Leave a comment:

  • Kiwehnzii
    Oldfart

  • Kiwehnzii
    replied
    Straight dancers from Ontario? I'm a bit confused.

    Leave a comment:

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