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victory song protocal

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  • victory song protocal

    I was emceeing a college powwow recently. During the opening sequences they had the usual flag song, but immediately a victory song was presented and every one danced with the flags. Now I've witnessed this on many occasions, and respect this aspect of plains tribal observances.
    But on this particular instance, a young "elder" came up to me and proceeded to berate me, saying that this was "being done wrong, and that we need to know what we are doing before we just go and do this and that."
    I was wondering - what is the prescribed protocal in this victory song observance.
    there are tribal differences that i want to know so i can accord the appropriate respect and know of pitfalls to be aware of.

  • #2
    All tribal preferences aside, I think it should be done however it is done at that moment; that's how it was meant to be. *L

    Geez, can't wipe around anyone without someone tellin' you you've done it wrong, so this should be interesting...

    ...that's so true....so, so true...

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    • #3
      The type of victory song i am reffering to is the double beat side shuffle.
      and in which every body danced together with the flag bearers.

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      • #4
        It would have been nice for the drum to give you the courtesy of waiting for you to announce the song before they just blasted into it.

        As for elders berating the emcee, the best thing I can do it is to politely thank them for their time and their advice, then simply move on from there. That should be all that would be expected of an emcee.

        If the 'elder' continued on and on however, I would get one one of my elder relatives to come and handle it on my behalf. It's much better than me getting upset and saying something that might get me in trouble, can you dig it?
        Big Pauly, Anishinaabe Ogitchidaa Aanikoominodewiwin

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        • #5
          Originally posted by SpeakingOwl View Post
          The type of victory song i am reffering to is the double beat side shuffle.
          and in which every body danced together with the flag bearers.
          thats how the meskawki does it in tama iowa....just yesterday the vets were retiring the flags...they ask for a flagsong and then a veterans...well the visiting northern drum sang a wonderfull dakota flag song....then this woodland drum sang the A I M ,song the best way they possibly could sang it for a veteran..im pretty sure denis banks said it was a memorial or remeberence song..
          sigpicMITAKUYE OYASIN... "then I was standing on the highest mountain of them all , and round about beneath me was the whole hoop of the world . and while i stood there I saw more than I can tell . and I Under Stood more then I saw . for I Was Seeing in a Sacred manner the Shapes of All . Hehaka Sapa. dec 1863-aug 17 or 19 , 1950.. listen online TO KILI 90.1 FM porcupine butte

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Pheji Wanbli View Post
            thats how the meskawki does it in tama iowa....just yesterday the vets were retiring the flags...they ask for a flagsong and then a veterans...well the visiting northern drum sang a wonderfull dakota flag song....then this woodland drum sang the A I M ,song the best way they possibly could sang it for a veteran..im pretty sure denis banks said it was a memorial or remeberence song..
            Dang, I feel that I'm getting further and further away from pow wows these days...what is a woodland drum? Not trying to start stuff...I just have no idea.

            Also, it seems that if this group knew the AIM song then they probably would have known some good Sioux vet songs to sing instead...I mean it's not like there is shortage of them or anything...lol...

            As for people berating you (especially "olders")...don't worry about it...everyone wants to be head chief these days...Next time someone comes up and berates you like that...especially those young "olders"...then politely tell them to please get on the mic and speak in their language and tell the crowd what's going on...LOL...yeah right...there are so many different ways of doing stuff (real ways I mean) that it's impossible to make everyone happy so if you're not at home then just go with the flow unless what the host tribe/committee is doing is in direct conflict with disrespects your ways...if so, just leave.
            I think everyone on this rez is addicted to Harry Potter...lol...

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            • #7
              i just saw them on my space music page which is theres...friendly voices..woodland singers
              Last edited by Pheji Wanbli; 06-08-2009, 04:05 PM. Reason: spelling
              sigpicMITAKUYE OYASIN... "then I was standing on the highest mountain of them all , and round about beneath me was the whole hoop of the world . and while i stood there I saw more than I can tell . and I Under Stood more then I saw . for I Was Seeing in a Sacred manner the Shapes of All . Hehaka Sapa. dec 1863-aug 17 or 19 , 1950.. listen online TO KILI 90.1 FM porcupine butte

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              • #8
                Originally posted by SpeakingOwl View Post
                I was wondering - what is the prescribed protocal in this victory song observance.

                The victory song is a fairly new addition to the powwow. At one time people just came into the dance arena whenever they got ready, unless it was a formal ceremonial. Heck and most powwows on reservations did not have the multitudes of dancers we have today!
                Powwows will continue to evolve in many directions. It is inevitable.

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                • #9
                  Victory song protocol.

                  How old is a "young elder"? If he was a "young elder" then he shouldn't be going around berating people if he himself doesn't know protocol. All of us who are 'practicing Indians' (lol) know that someone doesn't go up and give the emcee what for. Also the emcee (if he is a seasoned emcee) would have told the individual "I am only the emcee, I do what the committee tells me to do and if you have a complaint or something to say then I will refer you to the Pow wow committee." Also any elder knows that there are lots and lots of different tribal groups and what one believes, maybe another does not. So this will tell you that whoever the person was, he needs to keep quiet until he knows what he is talking about.

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                  • #10
                    i have been emceeing now for a number of years so as a seasoned vet. I still
                    try to be aware of local traditions. there are some places that are "tribe neutral". in these cases i don't feel it appropriate to answer negatively.
                    just put this thread to learn more about peoples' feeling in this matter.

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                    • #11
                      I have had similar instances with committee decisions that elders disagreed with,,, and no matter what you say they can find you real easy, track down who to argue with on the committee takes work, so you are probably going to get the earful.

                      Comment

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