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destroying the myth of aztlan and aztec HOBBYISTS

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  • #91
    Originally posted by koyoteh View Post
    if what you say is true about your son. then all you have to do is go ask him and them about what i say.

    ask them about the teachers that were sent to the states to teach here.
    ask them about what went right and what went wrong.

    but i am sure you know.

    i also know about these things. but i also rebel against the church. THe church forced took over the danzas. created a heirarchy and even kept the darker natives out. A lot of discrmintation existed in the church dance groups.
    on the oppposite side of the table , a lot of danza remained in the villages because well that where they devleoped but also because they were not allowed into the larger dance circles.
    but you would know that.
    i have been quiet from these forums for years. yes i can keep quiet. but when i hear people speak lies, well, sometimes i got to say something.

    or when i hear people mention a story with parts missing and i have one of the missing pieces, it becomes a responsibility to say something.

    no its the churches teachings that tell the heathens to stay quiet.
    i rebelled against those church ways. my group rebelled against those church ways.

    and if what you say is true about your son being a part of the dance circles in mexico, it will not take you long to figure out which rebellious dance group i come from.
    They will tell you. There is only one as far i know, us.

    you talk about being allowed to dance at a cathedral? then you know about the mesas. YOu know the aztlan stories. yet you put it down and allow others to do the same.

    you know that others besides your son were given permission to dance. you know how that works then.

    you know that the people here were given permission to dance, yet do you defend them or help out when they make mistakes? maybe you help out, but i haven't seen you defend them yet. quite the opposite.
    if what you say is true, then you do know about all the sub groups and branches.

    you also would know of the different styles of danza and their different ideaologies and philosphies and how many of the old church groups have told the people up here not to defend thenmselves or stand up for their rights or make changes that will save them.

    you will know about the warrior danza groups.
    My mother comes from the area of the mountain of the blue rock. I dance eagle bustle not azteca. I knpw who I am and I knpw where I come from. Both sides. I personally don't think you can put natives from this continent and say they are all the same. Culturally linguistics, traditions...are all different. A true statement would be "we are all indigenous". To think you have the right to go into Grand Entry as a danzante is the same as thinking you can walk into a closed aztec group and start dancing. Oil and water don't mix.


    Why must I feel like that..why must I chase the cat?


    "When I was young man I did some dumb things and the elders would talk to me. Sometimes I listened. Time went by and as I looked around...I was the elder".

    Mr. Rossie Freeman

    Comment


    • #92
      i do not know you JOES DAD. but this aztlan bashing , is taking place across forumsn and across social websites and being done by a few individuals.

      and all without one ounce of proof on their part.

      even their enemies provide proof for their claims even if the proof is incorrect at times, they still do it.

      Tha aztlan story is native. No matter who it comes from. The danzantes in mexico have it too. being a associated with them then you know this and you know the story is native. and you know the Mexica Movement has nothing to do with aztlan and the danzantes traditions surrounding the story.

      yet you do not defend the native story and allow the bashing to go on and contribute to the bashing instead disrespect your native associates ancestors.

      I know that the concheros do not promote warrior mentality but dang man. Help the natives out and defend their ancestors when they get bashed. and if some people are having misunderstandings shed light on those misunderstandings. from all sides of the table.

      and if there are fakes out there misusing native stories, call them out while defending the ones who use it correctly.

      i could only imagine that you might be one of the ones helping to contribute to the bashing in the other sites too.
      which is a sad thing when elders of other nations gangbang on other natives ancestors.

      Comment


      • #93
        [MENTION=216264]koyoteh[/MENTION] I mean, marrano, you must not know how to read... hooked on phonics may help

        aaaayyye
        When you are dead you don't know that you are dead. It is difficult only for the others. It is the same when you are stupid.

        "Show me somethin"

        Comment


        • #94
          Originally posted by koyoteh View Post
          i do not know you JOES DAD. but this aztlan bashing , is taking place across forumsn and across social websites and being done by a few individuals.

          and all without one ounce of proof on their part.

          even their enemies provide proof for their claims even if the proof is incorrect at times, they still do it.

          Tha aztlan story is native. No matter who it comes from. The danzantes in mexico have it too. being a associated with them then you know this and you know the story is native. and you know the Mexica Movement has nothing to do with aztlan and the danzantes traditions surrounding the story.

          yet you do not defend the native story and allow the bashing to go on and contribute to the bashing instead disrespect your native associates ancestors.

          I know that the concheros do not promote warrior mentality but dang man. Help the natives out and defend their ancestors when they get bashed. and if some people are having misunderstandings shed light on those misunderstandings. from all sides of the table.

          and if there are fakes out there misusing native stories, call them out while defending the ones who use it correctly.

          i could only imagine that you might be one of the ones helping to contribute to the bashing in the other sites too.
          which is a sad thing when elders of other nations gangbang on other natives ancestors.
          When you find yourself in a hole, you stop digging. Common sense...

          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by Joe's Dad View Post
            My mother comes from the area of the mountain of the blue rock. I dance eagle bustle not azteca. I knpw who I am and I knpw where I come from. Both sides. I personally don't think you can put natives from this continent and say they are all the same. Culturally linguistics, traditions...are all different. A true statement would be "we are all indigenous". To think you have the right to go into Grand Entry as a danzante is the same as thinking you can walk into a closed aztec group and start dancing. Oil and water don't mix.
            you are right and wrong. if you are using the term "you" in the general sense ok. but if you mean me. i never claimed to have any rights.

            but i will point out the contradictions and the hypocrisies of such things as pow wows.
            white people are allowed to dance and invited in. WHITE PEOPLE. thats weird. Many pow wows, not all, are ok with the fake white natives dancing and do nothing about it. They like the money they bring i think.
            Pow wows promote INTERTRIBALISM. yet have had a history of exluding many native people. I seen this for myself. And i am not talkign about mexicas. Many tribes hate pow wows because of this and the disrespect that pow wows bring into their lands.
            Me, i preferred to have everyone work out and suppport the idea of intertribal social dancing and i did. and it worked out fine.
            its hypocritical to say everyone is welcome to come dance and then exclude specific natives.
            to be a part of grand entry....you may be right. however, when a social gathering says all nations welcome....what does this mean?

            how should those nations visiting and joining in the fun show their respect? and at the same time folllow their own traditions of showing respect?

            if you know about danza azteca than you know this would be at the entrado. Now i do know its a culture shock and new and the whipman doesn't know where to place them, but still its a show of respect to the head man dancers and the ancestors of the original pow wow starters.
            if there are to be any exclusions the flyers should say so and not say all nations welcome.
            this implies that the gathering is OPEN not CLOSED.
            to compare to a closed danza circle is not valid. Its closed. but they will tell you its closed.
            most danza circle are open and yes you can just show up. but out of respect still should ask for permission.
            and yes, many danzantes have asked for permission to dance at pow wows. and yes many were invited to dance. you may not agree with those other elders who did the inviting but they did invite.
            and no its best to leave the church hymms at home.
            i know natives are not all the same. but then again when people make that statement it is VAGUE. leaves out too much about what do they mean by that? we are all the same in that we are all the same race. the same blood. but we are not all the same in that we have different languages, traditions, styles, things like that.

            we are all indigenous and my people over here say exactly that. we don't go around saying nican tlaca and retake the southwest like the mexica movement people would have others believe.

            Comment


            • #96
              Originally posted by gilisi View Post
              [MENTION=216264]koyoteh[/MENTION] I mean, marrano, you must not know how to read... hooked on phonics may help

              aaaayyye
              i read fine. ya just don't know how to communicate.

              ya guys do trash the mexica nazis but lump the innocent ones in there with them with the things you say.

              Comment


              • #97
                Originally posted by koyoteh View Post
                i read fine. ya just don't know how to communicate.

                ya guys do trash the mexica nazis but lump the innocent ones in there with them with the things you say.



                You say I don't know how to communicate, then you make yet ANOTHER false accusation.

                You can't read fine if you ain't reading.
                When you are dead you don't know that you are dead. It is difficult only for the others. It is the same when you are stupid.

                "Show me somethin"

                Comment


                • #98
                  still havent heard anyone destroy the myth. not even a dent or a poke. just name calling so far.

                  and ' i know a mexica from mexico '

                  and ' i don't like "

                  and "this is bs"

                  and 'who are you'

                  and 'you think you know everything'

                  but dam i came here to learn something about maybe the story was bad enough to be 'destroyed' and nothing nothing nothing .

                  and then some say " why should i tell you "

                  wth? did't somebody make this thread with the whole intention of doing just that? telling?

                  now somebody comes with an opposing story and info and you don't wannna talk?

                  just name call?

                  cmon. i want to hear why you thingk the story is no good. IF its valid I WILL SHARE IT TO OTHERS to point out that there are others who have valid points on why they disagree.

                  i been known to point out the sides of other natives to my people who get out of line so they can stop.

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Originally posted by koyoteh View Post
                    i read fine. ya just don't know how to communicate.

                    ya guys do trash the mexica nazis but lump the innocent ones in there with them with the things you say.
                    My turn to ask questions then...

                    Have you ever worked side by side with indocumented Mexicans?

                    How many days have you gone without running water?

                    without food?

                    Have you ever shed blood over these issues?

                    Have you ever been detained simply for being racially profiled?

                    Have you suffered alongside these innocents you claim to defend?

                    I want to see your regalia.. really show us some pics

                    I'm interested
                    When you are dead you don't know that you are dead. It is difficult only for the others. It is the same when you are stupid.

                    "Show me somethin"

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by gilisi View Post
                      [/B]

                      You say I don't know how to communicate, then you make yet ANOTHER false accusation.

                      You can't read fine if you ain't reading.
                      just playing around with you. cause thats all i see you doing here. playhin around. not saying anything. just name calling.

                      i can't really comment or respond to name calling or putdowns. doesn't really give me anything to talk about.

                      name calling smakc talking is fine in the streets to rile someone up to throw the first punch but this aint the streets. and if someone does throw a punch are ya gonna fight back or just continue the smack talk?
                      at least the others have begun to actually talk even though its still off topic.
                      they have interesting things to say even if i disagree with them .

                      you , ehhh, haven't said anything.

                      but if you wanna continue to play i guess i will play.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by koyoteh View Post
                        just playing around with you. cause thats all i see you doing here. playhin around. not saying anything. just name calling.

                        i can't really comment or respond to name calling or putdowns. doesn't really give me anything to talk about.

                        name calling smakc talking is fine in the streets to rile someone up to throw the first punch but this aint the streets. and if someone does throw a punch are ya gonna fight back or just continue the smack talk?
                        at least the others have begun to actually talk even though its still off topic.
                        they have interesting things to say even if i disagree with them .

                        you , ehhh, haven't said anything.

                        but if you wanna continue to play i guess i will play.
                        You haven't paid attention to what I have said, and more importantly, you haven't paid attention to what [MENTION=21858]Joe's Dad[/MENTION] has said. Play all you want.

                        Who wanted to destroy myths to begin with? eh? do you even know?
                        When you are dead you don't know that you are dead. It is difficult only for the others. It is the same when you are stupid.

                        "Show me somethin"

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by koyoteh View Post
                          just playing around with you. cause thats all i see you doing here. playhin around. not saying anything. just name calling.

                          i can't really comment or respond to name calling or putdowns. doesn't really give me anything to talk about.

                          name calling smakc talking is fine in the streets to rile someone up to throw the first punch but this aint the streets. and if someone does throw a punch are ya gonna fight back or just continue the smack talk?
                          at least the others have begun to actually talk even though its still off topic.
                          they have interesting things to say even if i disagree with them .

                          you , ehhh, haven't said anything.

                          but if you wanna continue to play i guess i will play.
                          that's too bad hijo de su madre
                          When you are dead you don't know that you are dead. It is difficult only for the others. It is the same when you are stupid.

                          "Show me somethin"

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by gilisi View Post
                            My turn to ask questions then...

                            Have you ever worked side by side with indocumented Mexicans?

                            How many days have you gone without running water?

                            without food?

                            Have you ever shed blood over these issues?

                            Have you ever been detained simply for being racially profiled?

                            Have you suffered alongside these innocents you claim to defend?

                            I want to see your regalia.. really show us some pics

                            I'm interested
                            ahh finally.

                            now i can say something. and what i have to say is this.

                            what does this have anythign to do with the topic of this thread?
                            destroying the aztlan myth?

                            everything i have said so far is in response to what people been telling me and asking me.

                            but i guess i can answer some even if its off topic. don't know why you wont' talk about the topic.

                            yes i have worked side by side with undocumented. marched with them. helped to promote their rights by guarding those fighitng for their rights. HELPED that means therer were others too.
                            what this got to do with aztlan myth?

                            i been lucky enough not have had to go without running water. but i mean lucky. barely pulling through. yes i know many do not have this. so i am lucky. but i was born in the city. i didn't ask to be here in this system of things. but again nothing to do with the topic.

                            shed blood? not me. others i know have. me things worked out smoothly in my time where no blood was spilled. i credit this to people getting along and uniting and working together constructively and strategically. I did my best to make sure no blood was ever spilled. and so did others. worked out fine.

                            been detained? from racial profiling? well thats vague. IF you mean at the border or ice raids and that no. but racial profiling and beeing detained yes. been fired for it too.
                            but again, nothing to do with aztlan story.

                            suffered alongside them? in what manner? i didn't live with them in the same room if thats what you mean.

                            defending them does not imply living with them or suffering with them.
                            they have their world of suffering and i have mine. and suffering is nothing to be proud of.
                            if you are talking about the undocumented, they are only ONE group of people that were helped. and my help was limited to guarding simply cause i don't speak spanish. The other did more. I was limited in what i could do to help.
                            doesn't have anything to do with destroying aztec myths though.

                            you want to see pics. uh no.

                            what am i supposed to say now? I show you mine if you show me yours?

                            perv. lol. i don't dance anymore anyhow. only on special occasions. like the other day a bro died and we danced for him. but other than that its been years. I got a gut now and my capitan called me chubby. of which i am not, but my gut showed a little. regalie shrunk i think.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by gilisi View Post
                              that's too bad hijo de su madre
                              lol. yes i am my mothers son. my dads too.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by koyoteh View Post
                                This thread is full of misinformation.
                                WHat is valid is the anger that some feel when they hear this misinformation.
                                The listeners do not necessarily know how to filter what they hear, they don't know the history of other nations, and they don't know about all the sub groups that branched off because of it.

                                THey are unknowing and refuse to admit that they just don't know.

                                all they would have to do is ask questions about how things developeed to be the way they are now. For other nations AND their own nations.

                                But instead they jump on the anti mexican bandwagon of U.S. Patriots and Freemasons and create hate pages on FB and block everyone who shows them facts of history they never learned about.
                                It does'nt seem they want to know.
                                So this was your first response to this thread... what does THIS have to do with destroying the myth?

                                AGAIN

                                You came here not only stating that EVERYONE on this thread doesn't know what they are saying, but that, I REPEAT,

                                we don't know our own history.

                                If you have such a problem with name calling...go to church... they have good manners in there sometimes
                                When you are dead you don't know that you are dead. It is difficult only for the others. It is the same when you are stupid.

                                "Show me somethin"

                                Comment

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