WOW..is it wrong for ppl to wear...

[Robin_1]

I never thought about it before til I read it on here.

IS IT WRONG FOR SOMEONE FROM ANOTHER TRIBE TO DANCE A DIFFERENT STYLE FROM THEIR OWN?

I know Northern people who dance Southern style and vice a versa. Is it wrong? I hope not.

[OILCAN]

I feel its alrite. If you wanna dance a different style then go for it.

We up here in Maine have our own Eastern dance style but most of our dancers dance grass, fancy and jingle styles.

It's the same with singing. We have a different beat and way of singin but I prefer the more contemporary northern style of singing.

IF IT FEELS GOOD ..... DO IT !!

[SNAGgles]

Re: WOW..is it wrong for ppl to wear...

Originally posted by Robin_1
I never thought about it before til I read it on here.

IS IT WRONG FOR SOMEONE FROM ANOTHER TRIBE TO DANCE A DIFFERENT STYLE FROM THEIR OWN?

I know Northern people who dance Southern style and vice a versa. Is it wrong? I hope not.

Its not wrong if you have been properly initiated / given permission to dance that style. And yes there is proper protocol. And be able to explain who how you got permission to dance that style.

Myself I would like to grass dance, but that particular style does not come from my tribe. I dance Northern Traditional and have a right to dance that style because I come from a northern tribe. And Yes I was properly brought into the circle at a younger age.

But before I ever dance grass I will have to obtain approval and be brought into the dance circle as a grass dancer and have approval of the elders. I already have a sponsor who I admire and respect as a an ndn man and as a grass dancer. And this is just me I want to be brought into the grass dance the proper way. Many of the grass dancers are whistle carriers and it should not be taken lightly. And yes there are many who dance who have not been properly brought into the arena and yes they will argue the point. But - just think about it and I'm sure you'll know what needs to be done.

In essence I want to properly be brought into grass dance arena for myself, for respect of ndn ways, respect for other tribes and their culture/ways, so I don't get hurt and so it doesn't come back on my family.

[luvstraightdancrs]

Great reply SNAGles...you are at least trying to do thing the right way.

Personally I have been dressed Otoe-Missouria and Kickapoo. Relationships were formed, elders were visited with, permission was given and a public address was made when I was plumed. It was very touching and very nerve racking at the same time. I am also adopted Choctaw - but never dressed in that manner.

I design and make regalia. I am very cautious about who I sew for especially if they want to dance a different style than that of their tribe. I ask alot of questions of the person wanting the outfit, I talk with others I trust about if this is the right way for them to go about it, etc. I alwaysask if they have a design in mind - makes my job alot easier, and if not what do they like and want to do with the dance. I am very careful about using others designs or parts of them. That's a big mistake in Oklahoma! Same as making clothes for someone that doesn't have the right to wear them.

So say I shouldn't worry about who hs the right and who doesn't - that it doesn't reflect on me. I disagree - I don't want anyone saying that because I made the outfit that I gave them the right to dance in that style of clothes or tribal affilation.

My son also want to grass dance but has been told that he cannot unless he goes though the proper ceremony and jooin the particular society. Hopefully things will work out for him by next summer.

Just my two cents -- Yes it does make a difference.........

[Robin_1]

I guess it would be easy if you were from a tribe in Oklahoma or a Northern Plains tribe. ;)

I am from a Western tribe and we have our own dances but we also like to join in at Pow wows so we can see and meet ppl from different tribes and areas.

[luvstraightdancrs]

I am from a Western tribe and we have our own dances but we also like to join in at Pow wows so we can see and meet ppl from different tribes and areas

I don't see that being from the West is a problem. Surely you have your own style of clothing - you have your own dances. What I think most people object is are those that "just throw it on" and go. Just because if looks nice or you like the style - doesn't make it okay. If you admire the style or clothes - get acquainted with someone that has the right to weat it, develop a friendship/relationship and tell them your desires. Let them give you the guidance you need. Ask them to explain the dance and why they were the clothes, where they got them and what they mean.

I personally would rather see the diversity among other tribes then everyone in T-dresses or Southern Cloth outfits.

How can I learn about your tribe if you look like one from this area? If you dress like an Oklahoma tribe - how am I to know that you are from the West and have different ways? Doesn't your dances loose meaning if you are not in your tribe's dress?

[tweety_rez]

Wow! I know everyone has their own opinions about this subject!

Here is mine! How did we ever get to this point???? Dancing is for everyone and anyone. I am all for more people out in the area and dancing, and if you want to dance a certain style thats fine, just please respect the style and keep to it, don't add or try to jazz it up with your own new fangled changes.

Don't you all think we are starting to sound a bit like the non Indians Country club set?? When we say you must get premission, you must go through this initiation or that initiation. These dances do not belong to anyone because they were given to us by the creator. We are a sharing race, and dancing is about enjoyment and celebrations. I think there are not enough people out there dancing, and I welcome anyone in to the area whether they want to dance their own tribal style or dance one on my tribe styles. Like I said before just so long you approach it with respect. Life is a learning process and you can expect that if you want to take up dancing another tribes style that you will learn as you go.

And remember when you get up there in your skills don't become a snob.....the ndn country club snob mob has enough in it as far as I am concerned. PEACE to you all and enjoy dancing and living!

[rwgirl]

Correction: these dances are not for everyone. These dances that are danced in the pow wow arena originate from ceremonial dances that pertain to certain tribes.
There is no country club to it. It is just common courtesy and respect to go through the proper procedures to earn your right to dance these dances. Study where these dances come from, that shows your native knowledge. To say, just go ahead it is for eveyone, is selfish and ignorant to our indian ways.
Example: Straight dance comes from the Heluska dance that originates in Oklahoma. These are ceremonies that are performed in Oklahoma at various arbors. The trot, or horse stealing dance, is a ceremonial dance that goes with this also.
As with Northern Tradition, chicken, jingle, fancy....the point is ...NO they do not belong to just everybody and just anybody can put on an outfit and do them. Pay respect to those that have sacrificed their time, effort, knowledge and other non material things that go along with these dances. All dances have an origin, everything started somewhere.....study it, as Luvs has said. Research it. There is no one who would deny you the right to dance, if you go about it with respect. We all want to see more dancing, what is offensive is those who wear the regalias with NO knowledge of the origins or dance the dances incorrectly because they have not been inducted into the arena and given the direction in which to follow in the arena.
I think everyone sees these dances at competition pow wows and think, well....I like that, I want to do that. That is fine, just go about it the right way. It's like following directions on a map, if you don't go about getting somewhere in the correct way....you will get lost and stay lost until you ask for directions.
Like I have said before...I know some pretty traditional men and women who will see a person in their tribal clothes and go up and ask you who your family is, etc, etc, and if you don't answer them correctly...they will very adamantly ask you to take their tribal clothes off and hurt your feelings. If something is valuable, will you not protect it?

[luvstraightdancrs]

Thank you rwgirl..........we must have gone to the same school. OLD SCHOOL!!

You are right - it's not a country club and I too, know some of the traditional men and women that ask questions. I also know that just because you have been adopted or taken into a family that you don't automatically have the right to wear their clothes. I see that alot and it just makes me mad. Unless you are dressed in a proper manner then don't assume that you can wear the clothes.

Too many people are dancing in other tribes clothing.....changing styles like some folks change daily clothes. One dance they dance jingle, the next they are buckskin, the following week they are fancy shawl, then end up in southern cloth. Unless it is given to you in the proper manner (yes there is a right and wrong way) stay within your tribal regalia and dance. Don't change up all the time unless it was given to you. It takes away from the beauty of the dance.

I agree - there needs to be more dancers -- but let's take care of it in a good way.

[Robin_1]

I have seen and heard some pretty terrible things when ppl wore their traditional clothes at powwows said by "Pow wow Brats".

One guy wore his traditional outfit from a neighboring tribe of ours and pow wow dancers from out of state or those who moved here gawked at him, laughed at him and made snide remarks...some even to his face. I was shocked and saddened. I thought "you guys should talk" some were Navajos dancing jingle with Ojibwe flowers and Oklahoma Southern cloth designs. I thought that was rude and kinda of sad. Because here they were in this persons tribal area and they were making fools of themselves by being disrespectful. They basiclly came for 'Da Money' and didn't know that this area was his homeland and he should be respected.

One person said to one lady wearing a Plateau hat "What is that? A trash can on your head".

In Seattle someone told a guy wearing a button blanket "What the hell are you wearing!".

And a lady with a salmon on her shawl they made fun of her saying she stunk like a fish that is why she was wearing that.

Some people need to understand that not all Indians dress the same...

At one Pow wow some people saw a woman wearing a Choctaw dress and said "What is that pioneer woman doing here".

I think ppl should learn about other tribes and their regalia.

[tweety_rez]

good point about ceremonial dances. There is a big different between ceremonial dances and pow wows. I believe there is good reason for the strictness when it comes to ceremonial dances. However when it comes to pow wows I don't really see those as traditional, like ceremonies. Once you bring in the big money you kinda lose the idea of tradition......in the pow wow.

Also, if you want to get technical, lets bring up the point of the dance origins? You know we are gonna get various opinions about who started what dance and if you really look at it, with there only being traditional, fancy and grass at most pow wows and jingle, fancy and traditional for women then we have alot of people out there dancing dances that aren't a part of their own tribal history. ................

I am open minded as I stated before.....just throwing some more into the discussion.

[goose]

Like my dad always said" if it's not yours, leave it alone" ha ha
We could really technical about this subject and it would probably offend alot of people, so just take it all with a grain of salt and be as respectful as you possibly can. I personally agree with rw and luvs, but then I know my origin of dance, being Ponca and Sac&Fox and growing up in those traditions.
But alot of people are not of the tribes that originally pow wow dance, but would like to dance and take part. If that is the case, just ask and there are those that will help you attain the goal you are seeking.
The arena is a wonderful place to make relationships and learn about other tribes. It is also strict at times and it is just best to gain as much knowledge as you possibly can therefore you won't offend anyone.
Money entering the arena has been a twist in the equation, but think about it.....indians have always been competitive. From who could run the fastest, shoot the the straightest, etc. from since time began. We are a competive race, and the fact that the new area of competition is pow wow dancing, we give it our all. Nothing wrong with that. Just take it all into perspective and do what you feel in honorable to the arena and to yourself.
It is not a country club, I hope not or else I forgot to pay my yearly dues...I've been too broke. LOL

[ron red eagle]

For me personally, I dance Northern Traditional, because well.. I am Ojibwe. I may live here in the south, but I (in my opinion) don't have the right to dance their styles. So, if I go to a pw that is dancing non-northern traditional, I sit and watch and enjoy. Until I have learned to dance their styles, and/or given the privilage and honor to dance with them.

RRE

[spicysouthern]

robin1 are navajos a southern or northern tribe? i seen a few navajos that dance southern in a oklahoma style pattern. are they considered a southern tribe its all kewl just asking

[ern_dawg2003]

buckskin dancing

I don't care who or what tribe dances buckskin, the laydees make that dance look so damn keen and sexy, they should be # 1.

Here are a few of my favorites
#1 Karey Abbey -northern Baybee!!!!!!
2 Danielle Sigwig
3 Salina Todome - northern
4 Dalynn Alley
5 Delaine Alley-Snowball
6 Justine McArthur -northern
7 Tooky Hamilton-Brady
8 Keri Bread
9 Deanna Deere
10 Shane Hughes- dayum fyne!!!
11 Toni Tsatoke

Oh did i Mentioned Karey Abbey -baybee!!!!