roach?

[Caroline]

I want to learn to make roaches. My friend has 3 little boys who want to dance , so I am making them little grass dance outfits. The place where I can get porky hair wants $55 and oz for the hair or I can get moose hair for $25 a pound from the same place. I have bought moose hair from them before to do tufting with. My question is -would it be ok to make roaches out of moose hair, or does it have to be porky hair?
I don't want to invest a bucket of $$ in hair only to find out that I can't make roaches worth a dang.
The moose hair I got last time was anywhere from 6-8 inches long.

[Tibiki Kinew]

If you can get moose hair that is that long go for it! thanks for telling me the price of porky hair, I just collected a bag full of the guard hairs!!!

[powwowbum49]

Caroline

I make roaches for a living and I would most definitely not replace the porky hair with moose hair. It is not nearly rigid enough to stand up well or thick enough at the tip to look good. Moose hair can be used in making a roach but not as a replacement for porky hair. it can be used as a base or as a replacement for the deer hair, but not the porky

Depending on the ages of the boys and the sizes of the roaches you are planning on making for them you shouldn't need much more than 4 oz and could probably get by with 3 oz. It takes about 1 oz of hair to make a 15" or smaller roach...about 1 1/2 oz for up to 18". For most young kids a 15" roach is plenty big enough.

Just the opinion of someone that does this for a living, but you will end up with a better piece if you stay with porky hair.

[Caroline]

roach

Thank you for letting me know that PWB. Moose hair is sort of hollow at the base so I guess that is why it wont stand up. It takes dye like a porqupine quill will though. I called the supplier and right now they don't have either porky or moose hair. I ordered some horse mane hair to try out. If It doesn't stand up, at least I will have something to practice tying with until I can get some porky hair.
The little boys are 8, 5 and 3 so the roaches will have to be small. I want them to have as complete outfits as I can make for them so they will learn to care for their regalia right from the start.

[Tibiki Kinew]

Hey I found out today that the bag of porky hair I have is exactly one ounce, and that came off of 12 dead porkies, so I guess it will take me a while till I get the 4 ounces together!!!

[Caroline]

roach

holy cow! 12 porkys? I guess $55 an oz for clean guard hair isn't too bad a price.

[Tibiki Kinew]

Yep 12!!! But guess what that gave me a total of 8 bags of quills and a lot of claws!!! That is all I got so far this year and I have been searching for them. The porky barely has any hair let alone guard hairs, those are the ones that stand above the quills and wave with every movement. The rest of the top of the body is covered thickly by quills, several thousand to be exact! Plastic claws cost a minimum of a buck a piece, I now have 60 real good ones that are real. Guess what I will be selling in august at the Golden Lake Powwow this year!!!!

[powwowbum49]

Caroline

Porky hair is also hollow at the base and that is what allows it to stand up well. The difference is that porky is much more coarse hair than moose hair is. The walls of the porky 'guard' hair shaft are much thick than regular body hair from other animals. The quills are just a modified hair and it is even more stiff that the guard hair (of coarse).

As to the size roaches to make for the kids. The 8 yr old I would make a 15" and a 12" for the 3 year old. As for the 5 yr old...you can make either, but a 15" would last him a lot longer.

Tibki

You are obvious dealing with eastern porkies. The porkies from the east do not have very long guard hair on them and that is why it has taken so many to get what you have, plus you are collecting them in the summer and not the winter when their coat thickens up. An average western porky in winter coat will give up from 1/2 - 3/4 of an ounce of guard hair. Most porky hair that is sold on the fur market is from western porkies.

[Caroline]

Thanks for the help with the sizes. What do You make your bases out of? Some look to me like they were braided or woven out of cord.

[Blackbear]

just a small note here... but you mentioned horse mane hair.. if you go the route of horse hair for roaches, you will want to do it from some quality tail hair I believe.

[powwowbum49]

I make my bases out of braided 4 ply yarn....oh yeah...the horse hair...it don't stand up worth a damn. When you get that hair in just sit it aside to use on bustles or something else like that later on.

[Tibiki Kinew]

I agree horse hair sucks, it falls over too much. Porky is always the best, very durable too!! Horse hair strands are good enough for dreqam catchers, and that is about it!!! hey there black bear, how is the weather up in the great white north????

[Blackbear]

today it was absolutely gorgeous .. perfect weather in fact! Which is nice cause we had a chilly rain stint there for a week or two.

[Caroline]

I ordered a horsehair roach kit from Noc Bay. I want to make sure I know what I am doing before I invest in porky hair.

[powwowbum49]

I can understand wanting to practice and know more how a roach will go together, plus if I were to suggest any 'roach kit' out there on the market it would be Nocbay's. There kit explains how to make a yarn base instead of sending you a crummy, premade cord base. Well at least their porky roach kits do...not sure about their horse hair ones. You can practice with the horse hair making medallion backers. They are tied using the same knots as used for tying a roach.