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Rip offs or innovators?

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  • Rip offs or innovators?

    Is the synchronized down beat or check beats an innovation or something used before?
    Last edited by Kiiwedinong; 11-21-2006, 01:49 PM.

  • #2
    Oh hee......

    Hey Ojibway Tribe I have 3 words for you;

    "She also has a very soft skin. The only trouble with snake women is they copulate with horses, which makes them strange to me. She say's she doesn't. That's why I call her "Doesn't Like Horses". But, of course, she's lying."


    • #3
      Yeah that's true........Midnite and Mystic's beat is not old style at all. I've also heard that Midnite sings songs that are used in Ojibwe ceremonies........just changed them up of course. Maybe to them it's a good thing they change and sing ceremonial songs, but I've heard it's not appropriate.


      • #4
        hi ya'll

        ive heard midnite sing around minnesota and it doesn't sound like they sing ceremonial songs to me..i go to ceremonials ...they sing old songs from way back. sounds good to me. i am a jingle dancer...correct me if i am wrong


        • #5
          midnight...they put soul into the songs they sing, that and they have the old style songs ringing in my ears...I too atend drum ceremonies avidly, in the spring and the fall, at the ceremonies they have straight songs after the ceremony part is done...and some of these songs are what i hear midnight, as for the honor beat, that is old style, all they had was just the one beat. but i think they could pick up the tempo, as an old style jingle dress dancer it's a might important to also need a new cd guys, i've got this one memerized and worn out! lmao:)
          There can only be 2 moccasins on your feet at one time...however life has given me many pair...along with a needle, thread and really sharp teeth to cut with...lmao


          • #6
            I'm not hating on anybody here. I think MIdnite and Mystic are two excellent drum groups. I actually like their style. I was just wondering what everybody thought about their drumming. Where I come from the synchronized check beats is not old style around here. I understand that it might be considered old style somewhere else, I dont have a problem with that. I was just wondering what everybody thought.
            Oh other thing, Midnite Express truly has some of their leads the old style. For those of you that dont know what I'm talking about. The leads on some of their songs are completed to the end, its like singing the whole verse to the end. You know what I mean? Thats the old style around my area.
            Midnite is an excellent original style group. I was only wondering what others thought about their style seeing that I heard a lot of people complaining about their style.
            Thats all.


            • #7
              I think that the style of drumming that Midnite Express uses is cool. It pumps people up and makes them come alive. That is what drums are to do at a pow-wow.

              I personally don't care if it is considered original or not, or if another group used it first. It goes well with their aggresive style of singing.
              It is so sad that a family can torn apart by something as simple as a wild pack of dogs.


              • #8
                :Angry I GO TO CEREMONIES AS WELL! I KNOW ALL OF MIDNITE EXPRESS!! They DO NOT sing "those" songs! One of those men on that sing with Midnite BELONG on two of those SPECIAL DRUMS and would sooner cut off his own hands than sing THOSE songs at a pow-wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!
                tuck & roll


                • #9
                  OK here it goes...........

                  OK, Ojibway_tribe. First of all I feel that if these "people" have a problem with the way Midnite Express drums then they should be talking to the the group. I haven't heard any complaints when Midnight was taking first here and there. Especially not at Post Falls where there was only one drum contest and all 24 drums were competing for 1st place(Original, Contemporary, and Southern). As far as I know. People seem to like Midnite Express the way they are.

                  To me, Midnite sings old style songs and are bringing back some of the old style beat that Badlands had started back in their day. I know for a fact that they don't sing cerimony songs. I am of that Society and would know if they were or not.

                  To me. Original Style means singing Straight songs. No words or throat pinching. The drumming style is up to the group. Midnite has managed to take Original singing to another level. That's all. At the same time respecting the Original style of Mandaree, Battle River, etc.

                  lakota_hochunk, your a piece of work. If you are an actual singer. Or a singer on "cerimonial" drums you wouldn't be here tryng to "hate". You'd have more respect for your ways. I don't think you'd know a cerimonial song if you heard one.

                  In today's contest pow-wow circuit. You have to have some uniqueness to your singing or your dancing. That's exactly what Midnight has done.

                  I can't talk for Mystic. I haven't heard them in awhile. But, I respect them as singers and will leave it up to them or their relatives to come here and post something.

                  enuff said................ :36: (for now)


                  • #10
                    More power to MIdnite. THey can Jam.
                    Those "people" that think otherwise are the more traditional elders of the pow wow circuit. Ever hear of the phrase "respect your elders?" I'm doing just that.....I dont agree with them or disagree with them. I respect each others own opinion is all.
                    You got it??


                    • #11
                      I just got done dancing to their cd, they really do make you want to jam, i know my brother doesnt like them, but thats only when he's singing against them in a contest, other wise he like the songs they sing, i know a few that my granpa used to sing and i heard them sing it at bismark, made me cry, cause they made it sound better than the old misho...well not better, just more refined, i think thats what they're trying, well not even trying really they just, sing they're heart and souls into those songs, and you can feel it, well i know i can, the people who complain are just plain jelly, kinda reminds me of eyabe when they first started out...but i hope these guys never burn out and become like the badlands singers, classic and saty together even when they become old wrinkly men with lots of grand kids who sing just like them...lmao, thats how i feel about they're singing:Thumbs :Frog :Jumping:
                      There can only be 2 moccasins on your feet at one time...however life has given me many pair...along with a needle, thread and really sharp teeth to cut with...lmao



                      • #12
                        I ain't tryin to hate on Midnite. I give them all the congrats in the world for being the kind of drum that they are. And wish them nothing but the best, wherever the road may take them I hope it's safe for them. I just know someone that goes to ceremonies and as a matter of fact his father is well known throughout these Ojibwe ceremonies. So, I figured that there must be some truth behind all of this. Maybe I should re-clarify what I said earlier. On Midnite's very first CD, there are ceremony songs that they changed. The leads in particular are so similar to ceremonial songs. Again, maybe I'm wrong, it's just what I've heard from a reliable source.


                        • #13
                          Gotta say, each ojibwe tribe/band/rez has their own songs that are sung at cermonials, not to mention that there are many different types of cermonials where songs are sung. My dad has no idea who Midnight Express is and he made the same comment about the songs sounding like some ceremonial songs, he was even able to hum along and say this is how it really goes and to me that is close enough.


                          • #14
                            My Grandma doesn't even go to pow-wows. MAYBE just a small traditional one IF THAT. She goes to ceremonies ALWAYS. She has heard a couple of our pow-wow tapes or seen our videos from all the ones we attend and has stated that certain songs sounded like SPECIAL songs. And it wasn't Midnite Express singin'. Besides I know Johnny Smith helped these guys when they were little and I NEVER heard him sing a ceremonial song at a pow-wow.
                            tuck & roll


                            • #15
                              Mystic River and Midnite express are orginal-style drum groups. they do not sing any word songs(with exception to flag songs,veteran songs, and occasional old school lakota word songs by Mystic River). You can also tell by the way they hit the down beats, maybe they are all together, but it is only 4 or five beats together. you do not see any one singer hitting the down beats, or pausing, or three in a row, etc. You can tell by the way they sing too. It is not the same pitch as a contemporary drum would hold. Maybe they are gettin fancy in their ways, but that what makes them unique, and it does not knock them out of the original category. to me they are alot more original stlye than say Battle River, i mean sometimes you see them hit fancy down beats and stressing leads.


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